Speaker 2: Hello. This [00:00:30] is learning to dad and I'm Tyler Ross. My guest today is Tim Burch, Tim and I have known each other for a long time, but we've really just kind of started to get know each other, uh, recently. So I know a lot of the things that you have going on now, like you've got three kids, you into skiing. You're a project manager at boa with some high-end luxury, uh, renovations and remodels. And, uh, you worked on the extreme makeover television show, but like, I don't have a whole lot of background or history on you. So I'd be interested in getting started, like, [00:01:00] give me, give me getting out of school and the trajectory of viewer entering into the job March.
Speaker 3: So I, um, I'm third generation builders, so it was sort of always in my blood, but when I was, um, going to college, I wanted to be an artist. Yeah. So I have a BFA degree, which slowly started to morph into more sort of building stuff as I, as I got through, uh, the different years at school and then graduated [00:01:30] with a design degree and sort of jumped right in doing that. What school was that? Uh, JMU James Madison. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, my sister's OT
Speaker 3: School there. Nice. So did that then, uh, worked for my father for a bit. I mean the family business and then he retired. So I started kind of my own consulting group, which I did for a number of years and then got involved in some association stuff and then ended up being the president of the remodeler's association in DC and [00:02:00] sort of working on industry things and then sort of found my way in television somehow. It's so cool. And then, you know, the show I was working on extreme make-over was canceled. So like the next week, somehow I found myself at my new desk at boa and I've been there ever since.
Speaker 2: So at what point did you, uh, in your professional career have like the introduction of, you know, Melanie, your wife? Like when did you get married? When did you have
Speaker 3: Kids? So we actually knew each other in high school. [00:02:30] She says, I always used to kind of try to hit on her and stuff in high school. I don't remember any of that. I think she just made that up. But anyway, we, after college, we got together pretty quickly. I mean, it was one of those things within a couple months, she moved into my bachelor pad and I kicked all my friends out and, you know, went through that whole thing, which a lot of us, I think do, and then we got married and we actually wanted to move to Vermont. And so we, we, we ski a lot and that was something that we wanted to do. And, but we couldn't find [00:03:00] work there. So we ended up, we got married up there and then came back and lived in the Fairfax and then moved to Warrington in the late nineties. So did you guys both
Speaker 2: Grow up here? Did you go to high
Speaker 3: School here? No, I, I went to high school in Oakton. I was in high school and Melanie went to w uh, L so in Arlington, she lived in Arlington.
Speaker 2: How long was it until, uh, you got married? Like how
Speaker 3: I was 26, I think. And she was 25.
Speaker 2: [00:03:30] And when do you have your
Speaker 3: First kid? Two years later. So, yeah, we were, we were super motivated for kids like right off the bat, you know, where you said we want to have where you are, where the people that want, now we're going to have 10 kids and all of this, but we gotta, we gotta kind of a life lesson really quick with our kids and that our first daughter was born, uh, and then found choosing the NICU for eight days, you know, treat all that, no tube down the throat and the whole thing. I mean, just scare the heck out of us [00:04:00] and then had to kind of work through that. You know, you expect your first child, you're going to bring him home the next day and you know, everything's going to be happy. And that wasn't the experience we had. You know, we were stuck in intensive care for eight days and, and the first, probably three to four days didn't really know what was going to happen.
Speaker 3: I mean, it was sort of touch and go there for a little bit. So that was, that was kind of traumatic for us. And we, um, and we kind of became kind of helicopter parents with our, with our first born right after that, you know, I mean, [00:04:30] just like watching her and then, you know, the funny and not so funny, our next two children, the same thing happened. So all three of our kids were in NICU is exactly eight days. You're kidding. Yeah, it was. My wife is just a, got one of those bodies where when you, when you give birth, part of the, I'm sure you know this, but the part of the birth process is as they're pushing, it sort of pushes all that stuff out of the infant. Like the squeezing [00:05:00] push of the stuff out of their lungs. Well, Melanie would just give birth really quick.
Speaker 3: It was just a genetic thing. So our kids, you know, we try to like keep them in there as long as possible, but I mean, long story short, we have a plaque up at Fairfax hospital with all of our kids' faces and we know all the nurses there still and, you know, it's, it was it, you know, everything kind of comes to a positive and it was one of those experiences that sort of, you know, I think for our children made us [00:05:30] really connected to them because that's sort of the first breath of life when it's, there's a lot of trauma like that. It's kinda, it's kinda hard to get through and you sort of, it changes things a little bit. I'm not sure how to describe that, but the threat of
Speaker 2: Them being taken away upon not even having them yet, our daughter was born at 34 weeks. And she was like, I recall, I remember the room like vividly, there were like eight nurses there, three doctors, they had all this equipment and fortunately [00:06:00] she was born, you know, five pounds and a couple ounces. And then suddenly the room just, they looked at her said, she's fine and left, but I can only imagine the activity in a room like that. What can you, do you have
Speaker 3: Memories of total vivid memories of that? I mean, the first thing you probably like look for when you were, you know, especially with the first is you want to hear that cry and Chloe, our oldest wasn't crying and I'm like, what's going on in that I could see sort of some concern with the doctors' faces. And it was the same [00:06:30] thing. All of a sudden there was 50 people in the room and I went, oh man, this is not, this is not good, but I will say, I mean, those, those folks are just amazing and kids are resilient at that age. So if stuff's going to happen, you know, they they're incredible how they bounce back. So anyway, we, um, we got really sort of into sort of all of the medical stuff so much. So when our second we had, or our physician had a midwife, [00:07:00] that was also part of the thing.
Speaker 3: And when Melanie was giving birth to my son Stratton, I w I told her, I'm like, Hey, is there any way I can, because I was so into it now I knew all the parts. I knew all the stuff I knew what was happening. I said, can I, can I give, can I pull him out? And she's like, sure. So I actually delivered my son and then he was okay for a little bit, but then he had some wet lung. He was the strongest of our three kids. He's still spend some time in NICU. And then our youngest, [00:07:30] by the time it happened, they said, look, this is probably going to happen again. But we were confident and, um, you know, everything turned out. Okay. But yeah,
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I've got vivid memories of my daughter being bored and watching, like a lot of people say, do watch. And they're like, that seems so gross, but it's like one of the most beautiful things I've ever seen. And to think that you actually got the, you know,
Speaker 3: Just incredible stuff and, you know, you're talking, uh, if there's memories that sort of stay with you. So after my daughter was [00:08:00] born at that first traumatic event, I mean, you know, shows on TV or news shows about kids and neonatal thing. I couldn't watch any of it. I mean, it was almost like I had to go through this like catharsis therapy with myself to sort of get used to all of that, which now none of that bothers me, but it was just, uh, you know, it was just tough thing to go through, but anyway, everyone's doing great. So it was, you know, it's one of those things that just sort of happens and you work through it like other stuff in [00:08:30] life, you know?
Speaker 2: Yeah. So do you have any, uh, advice for anyone that might be, you know, sitting in a NICU, listening to the podcast?
Speaker 3: Yeah, actually we, so that's actually a great question when Chloe was born, you know, we didn't know what was going on and the nurses and doctors are great, but they're really busy. I mean, there's a lot of stuff going on in this critical and you know, they don't necessarily have time to kind of tell you about the emotional way to, to handle that. So when, when strapline was born in the same thing happened, [00:09:00] there was some other, you know, I noticed there were some other parents in there younger than us that have were going through the same thing. And I asked the doctor, I'm like, look, is there like a support group for this? Cause this could really help. Cause I was talking to one of them like, Hey, here's what happens. They're going to do this. And you're getting a C-PAP machine. And like, knowing if the doctor is explaining that, but you don't know really what the outcome's going to be.
Speaker 3: And not that we started that, but a lot of hospitals now do that. And any, any parent that's going through that, or, or [00:09:30] potentially may have a at risk birth, just look at for those groups. Cause there's a bunch of parents that have gone through the same thing. And it's so great to hear because most of the time and not all the time, but most of the time, you know, as I said, kids, kids are resilient and they kind of bounce back from that stuff. But you're, as a parent, you're so scared cause you don't, you don't know what's going to happen. And just to listen to some other folks, tell you, Hey, you know, here's what we were on a list at fair Oaks, we'd lived here. Actually. We had moved to Warrenton [00:10:00] at that point. But for parents to call, if they were really freaking out at 3:00 AM, you know, we were like, Hey, call tell them to call us. And the reason that, because our kids plaque is on the doll, like, Hey, these kids are made it through. And we, we did that on purpose because we wanted parents that were in there to say, look well, this family had three kids come through here.
Speaker 2: It's amazing. Did you ever get any phone
Speaker 3: Calls? We did. We got a couple of phone calls. I think now, you know, that was, you know, 20 years ago or [00:10:30] 15 years ago with our, with our youngest. And I think now there's much more, you know, I think probably they right away have support groups for you then or now, but you know, it was, it's definitely something when you talk to somebody that went through it, it helps
Speaker 2: Kinda part of the point of the conversations like this is to help, you know, men who have this definition of masculinity, that's been thrust upon them through their environment or their family or history or whatever to Blake encourage them to, if that's [00:11:00] the, the avenue to be better, make that phone call, don't be afraid to be vulnerable and having an emotional conversation about what's happening. Especially if it's about your kid. Absolutely. It's most important thing you can do is make decisions for the benefit of your kid and to get your ego or history.
Speaker 3: And even as they, as they move through, I mean, my kids are, are a little older than yours and you know, we've had them go through all the stages. I have two in college now and I think you're right. Like men tend to stay [00:11:30] say, well, you know, I don't, I don't have time to get involved in, you know, PTA. That's not for us, but nowadays it's not like that. Yeah. I mean, everyone's involved and it took us. I mean, my daughter, my first born had, I think the bad end of the deal because we sort of didn't really realize that. And as our kids, as each one sort of went through and her last child that was in elementary school here, we, you know, Melanie and I were on the, on the playground committee and raise a bunch of money to get the playground going [00:12:00] and all the stuff that we were like, man, we wish we would've done that with Chloe too. So now we work extra hard to support her. She's making an album, the second phase of life.
Speaker 2: It's all kind of lumpy. So kids get the lumps. I thought I'd get the lumps out back. That's right. Oh man. So going through that experience at what stage were you in your professional life? Like, were you on pretty solid footing or were you kind of introducing yourself to building
Speaker 3: W when the kids were born? We actually had our, [00:12:30] I just go off on my own. Yeah. So it really was, it couldn't have happened at a, at a harder time because, you know, I was missing work and, and, um, but it's amazing when, you know, when stuff happens with your kids, you sort of really quick realize what's important and that other stuff that you think is so, you know, I gotta be at this meeting or I have to do that instantly just gets pushed aside. Yeah. Which is kind of, uh, you know, I think a lot of stuff should get pushed aside [00:13:00] doesn't, you know, but that sort of forces you, but yeah, we were, you know, we were starting a company up during that point and it was, you know, it was tough, but I don't want to, it was still all fun.
Speaker 3: It was, you know, time management became a big thing for my wife, Melanie and I is, you know, how do we plan our days? So we have enough time to, to do all the stuff that we want to do with the kids. And, you know, at that point we got a home office, so it was all right there and juggling all of that and making [00:13:30] sure people were, you know, kids were getting the right attention and you know, all of that stuff, everyone deals with it, but it's time management is a huge thing you have to work on
Speaker 2: Or anything in any strategy in particular that you've implemented. And I know people talk about batching and blocking hours and things like this baby knows no schedule.
Speaker 3: I mean, I would do, it was almost like the kids came where we were first priority. And then there were certain times I knew and we had to do things with the kids, so that time [00:14:00] would get blocked out. But I had a mentor kind of growing up and I was consulting with this firm in Northern Virginia and he really worked on time management skills. So I would do that. I would sort of lay the whole day out and then plan, you know, when I can make my calls, which is typically when I was driving, you know, trying to multitask do that kind of stuff. So that when I was home, I was not stuck on the phone. And in doing, you know, not paying attention. It's funny, you know, as, as you get older, though, I think not only, you know, [00:14:30] kids go through different cycles, but parents do too, because then I went through a whole phase where, you know, professionally, I was doing all the stuff I was going to the dinners and, you know, going out with friends and during that night, there was like a three year period, you know, I hate to even bring up, but I wasn't that great of a dad.
Speaker 3: I don't think I sort of like, oh, I've got them going in the right way. And sort of, you know, now it's time to, I got to do this and that and the other, and you, you kinda, you have to really sort of focused. [00:15:00] And it was like a three-year period where that my professional life sorta took number one. And, uh, I sort of regret that now. You know,
Speaker 2: What do you think was, what do you think was driving
Speaker 3: That? I mean, we were, I think it was, you know, my wife's a really good mom and I think, I felt like while she's got it, she's got it. And I can go do, you know, go out and have this meeting or whatever, or go out afterwards with some friends or whatever. And it's okay. And I [00:15:30] think I sorta took advantage of that. I mean, this is all natural stuff that people go through, but
Speaker 2: Additional, you know, way the gender roles have been defined over decades.
Speaker 3: And we're not that kind of family, we're not traditional family. So it was just, you know, it was, I have young friends that I see that are young dads and they're starting to do that. And anytime I see that, you know, everyone needs their own time away and stuff. And I'm like, look, you know, here's, here's, there was a period [00:16:00] of my life where I thought that was greatest. Let me just tell you, it's not, you know, you really need to, to make your priorities and make sure you get the stuff sort of where it needs to be. And I don't know,
Speaker 2: I'd like to hear a little bit about you're starting your own business going from, you know, being salaried or an employee to, you know, creating your own entity, taking that risk and then managing that risk at the same time as having a baby.
Speaker 3: Yeah. It was, that's hard, especially like I'd mentioned, [00:16:30] we had a home office, so you can't, you can't really tend to get away from it. We would do it in shifts. I know that was one thing I'm trying to think back to that time. It was a long time ago, but we would do it in shifts where if I was busy in the office and couldn't be doing, and I'm talking sort of after, you know, kids were probably in school at this point, but you know, when they were at home, we try to make sure that both of us weren't in there kind of working together. We work together as a husband and wife too, which is always hard. Then Melanie actually got a job at one point [00:17:00] and it was just me at home. No kidding. Yeah. And so I took a lot of the, you know, I would run kids back and forth to soccer or whatever, you know, it was going on at that point, but it is a balancing act.
Speaker 3: And I, and you just, I mean, I don't really know if there's any, any sort of process that I thought worked better than others other than time management. And that's been a continual continual thing throughout my wife, you know, I'm 50 now. And I still spend 20 minutes [00:17:30] to 30 minutes every morning, sort of trying to map out my day. And a lot of it's still, we still have a daughter at your high school is, and really involves manager that lacrosse team cheerleader and all this stuff. And you know, her life is really busy and we want to be there for all of that. So it's like, how can I schedule my day to be able to, to do all of that stuff? Yeah.
Speaker 2: So, and so that's a, that's a theme for us to time management. And I've found that lists in the morning and having set goals and crossing things off.
Speaker 3: [00:18:00] Absolutely make a huge difference. And when you don't, when you forget to do it, you can really tell how your, how your day goes downhill. You don't have that sort of model to go from.
Speaker 2: I said, what was the environment like that they grew up in, they grew up in kind of a country setting or a
Speaker 3: In town setting. Yeah. I mean, we're, we were really lucky that we moved out here. I think we lived in Fairfax when, um, our firstborn was first born and then moved out here. I think Chloe was three and Stratton was [00:18:30] just born. As a matter of fact, Melanie was pregnant when we moved out here. So we were lucky to be out here. You think it's, it was a great, we live in a sort of rural area, but there's a neighborhood around us. Um, but we have, you know, sort of a, a nice format setting and it was just a great, great way to raise kids. They were involved in all of that to horses and, and things like that. So I think, I mean, everyone has their own way to raise kids, but we, we really felt where we [00:19:00] were living was a good, good place to, to raise them
Speaker 2: Talking about different ways to raise kids. Then I'm going to jump to a different topic, which is how does your parenting style compare and contrast with?
Speaker 3: So Melanie is the enforcer. Yeah. I mean, that's just the way it works in our family. And then the kids will come to me and go, dad, mom said, this can be really, I mean, I'm a, sometimes I, you know, as they're older now, I'm the one that kind of gives in a little [00:19:30] funny story. So my son's playing club lacrosse at east Carolina and, you know, tuition for, of states not, not cheap. So we're, you know, figuring out how to pay for all of that and doing all of that. And then he's like, oh, by the way, I need a $600 for dues. And he's like, no way, it's not happening. You know, you're concentrating. Then he waited a day and then Kate, I think there's any way I could pay you back. And of course I kind of, I like, I, you know, and then [00:20:00] afterwards it was fine. Then we talked about it and that's the way, I mean, we want them to have kind of a well-rounded education and experienced sports and playing and having to juggle all of that too. But I think that's, that's the way it works in our houses. Melanie lays down the law and I'm, you know, jokingly, I'm the fourth kid. So it happens with me as well.
Speaker 2: That's great. And that's funny because I know it's true. Listeners know it's true. So we've with [00:20:30] Melanie being the one that lays down the law. I like to ask about like punishment. Like I talk about kids being like a bowling ball and life being the lane, and you put the bumpers in a little bit, but every, now you gotta take the bumpers out eventually, but the bumpers are like our rules. They are our way of making sure that they get disciplined or like, do you have a way of, or did you have a way of kind of punishing your kids when they were out of, you know,
Speaker 3: For the younger kids? It was, they weren't allowed to see their, for my older [00:21:00] kids and when they were younger, not see their friends and as it's gotten, you know, with my youngest now it's, the phone goes away and that's a big motivator because, you know, everyone does everything on their phone now, but for the most part, I mean, we've kinda, you know, knock on wood, been pretty lucky with that and that the kids didn't push us too much. I mean, the experience and did things that all kids, I think, you know, especially during the high school age do, but they kind of stayed, they sort of knew. I think we sort of [00:21:30] put some values in them growing up that, you know, what's right and what's wrong, but then did try to give them a little bit of leash and not, you know, hovered so much that the can't experience anything. And I've seen that happen with some of my friends have just been like on their kids and then they get in college when they're away. And within a week they're like in trouble because it's the first chance to do anything, you know? And I think it's a, it's a tough balance to, to make sure that you, um, [00:22:00] you kind of instill those values and monitor it, but still let them sort of experience life and making mistakes and, and do that kind of thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah. That's, uh, it's at three and four are the ages of my kids. Like I don't ha I basically have no idea what to do other than just try to talk to them and logic doesn't necessarily make sense. So it's, it's been, you know, you don't get to play with your iPad, which we try not to give it to them too much, [00:22:30] but like, did, did your kids, I mean, I guess the iPhone came out in 2007, so your kids would have been w w
Speaker 3: Uh, well, I have a 23 year old, a 19 and a
Speaker 2: That's a really young, did they, were, they kind of grew up in the world of screens. I didn't, you didn't. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah. So that, I mean, that's a big thing if they can't use their, I mean, that's how that all kids communicate now. So we take that away, but other things, other lessons I'm trying to think that would happen. [00:23:00] Other than that, like, so our daughter, our oldest and I, she probably wouldn't mind that I was telling the story, you know, went away to college and we were really excited and she got in university of Arizona and we have a family house out there and it was, it's a big part of our life. And then just didn't, didn't take, she's like, I hate, I don't like it here. I don't fit in, came back here, worked for her, you know, by her worked here in town, actually at various restaurants and other things for a year and a half. [00:23:30] And she sort of experienced life and what it would be to sort of be on your own.
Speaker 3: And that was, that was kind of a thing we did strategically. Is that okay? Well, if you're going to come back, then you're going to be really supporting yourself. Yeah. And she sort of did that and then figured out she wanted to get back to school now taken after the old man's interior design major at Belmont university, but she's paying, she paid for the first semester by herself. And it was just that, you know, that was kind of tough because I was like, seeing her struggle a little bit like, oh man, you know, how [00:24:00] am I going to do this? But we tried to stick to our guns and now she's got grants for, I mean, it's just amazing stuff. She's on the Dean's list. And, and it's just amazing how each kid is different too. And you probably, well, I'm sure you know, that already see it just at three
Speaker 2: Or four, they're wildly
Speaker 3: Different. Yeah. So I mean, the way I would sort of try to, to parent my son versus my youngest daughter is totally different. I mean, just so you have to kind of adapt to that. [00:24:30] Um, and then there's always, you know, boys and girls difference in how you, how you parent and
Speaker 2: Are you, or are any of them like you, do you look at that
Speaker 3: And go to Chloe's exactly what my oldest is exactly like me. And she's pretty much made the same mistakes that I would, which is good. Cause I can tell her, and Stratton's like a cut my middle. Son's a combination. And my youngest is Melanie. Exactly. Oh yeah. And they're the, you know, it's me and, and them now at the house I get [00:25:00] ganged up on.
Speaker 2: Oh, what fun? Um, I just got lost in thought,
Speaker 3: It's good. You know, I deserve that sometimes. It's like, you know, I'm definitely sometimes the kid awesome too. Those two are
Speaker 2: Well, so, so what was your growing up like in comparison to the way your kids have grown up? Like, I know your dad he's around here. Like you guys still hang [00:25:30] out. Like we do. Was that your relationship to him? I find that people either go total 180 to the way that they were raised or do what happened to them because it seemed to work. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean, it was sort of similar for me growing up in that my mom was the discipline and my dad was the kind of, you know, you'd be a little bit easier on me until it came to when he, if you see him a love to tell you the story until it came to like the business stuff and learning the business, [00:26:00] he was like very strict with me on that. Like, here's the way this happens and you don't do things halfway. And, and you know, we've tried to do that same sort of parenting with our children, but, you know, we grew up in Northern Virginia, which at that point was sort of rural. So it's kind of the same sort of setting because when, when I, when we were living there later, it was very urban. So now it's sort of the same setting.
Speaker 2: Who do you think there's any advantage [00:26:30] or disadvantage to like kind of the era that you were growing up in versus the era like the non-screen era? I think that,
Speaker 3: I mean, I would have loved to have had more of that yeah. With my kids and not have them so tied to the screen. I understand it. And I mean, that's the way, I mean, there, you remember it, like they weren't allowed to, or you maybe weren't even allowed to bring phones or stuff in the school, but now they have to, I mean, they, they work on, you know, their phones. I, of course didn't have a phone [00:27:00] when I was in there. Exactly. But I, you know, I wish there was some more of that because I do see my kids and when they're all home from school and everyone's kids are home for spring break or the summer or whatever, they're all, you know, there'll be three of them in the room and they're all looking at their phone and I'm like, Hey, come on, put those things down. Let's go outside. Or let's do still, you know, and that, I think in general kids these days don't get that, you know, we have to, I think as parents kind of push them to [00:27:30] experience other stuff than the screen. Yeah. Or put punch in numbers or whatever, you know, anyway.
Speaker 2: Yeah. There's a real lack of kind of face-to-face interaction that, you know, like we grew up with. And, uh, I feel, I wonder about the freedom to, because the joke about the pocket full of quarters. I remember in seventh grade, I rode my bike from, in town of Warrenton to Orleans is that wow, 12 years old, 13 years old, I had a pocket full of quarters and a beeper [00:28:00] mom needed me. She'd know where I was, but I'd get that within an hour. I'd be at a payphone somewhere, be fine. But now if it's not back in five minutes,
Speaker 3: I start freaking out. Everything's so instant in, I think, um, you know, I'm sorta typecasting or probably this unfair to say, but kids, if they can't figure it out really quickly, they start to panic. As opposed to what you're saying. I mean, there's ways to just sort of like get through things we talked [00:28:30] about in another conversation about kind of getting away and off the grid. Right. So I've told my kid, I told you about that trip. I went on hiking in Michigan. Some friends here actually from, from Warrenton area, we'd go every year, but you're just totally unconnected. There's no connection. There's no way anyone's coming to get you. Something happened. You're a day out for help, which he never was like, why are you doing that? But that's why we do it. Right. Exactly. It's just all the reasons you just said that one trip sort of saves me for [00:29:00] the rest of the year. And then by the time it's ready for it. I'm like jumping out of my skin and like ready to do it again, because it's just amazing what that does for you. You know, how's that
Speaker 2: Melanie deal with that, like while you're gone, were you able to do that? Like while the kids were teenagers,
Speaker 3: We did something and we went, we went hiking a lot and skiing and things like that. And we were very active. Melanie does not, is not a big camper. She'll love, like she likes to do overnights and things like that, but she knows that it's like thump. Tim's got to go do that. [00:29:30] I'm a, like, I'm
Speaker 2: A lot better in seven
Speaker 3: Days she like pushes me out the door. Like,
Speaker 2: Please get you behaving less, pull more poorly at home. So that Sarah gives me the booth three or four
Speaker 3: Days. But it's amazing, you know, that I get some of that for kids these days, I think would be only an advantage, you know, just to try to maybe put the phone down for a day and see what your kids do.
Speaker 2: So the weirdo, they go 24 hours without a phone, whatever that little Birch kid, a little Ross' [00:30:00] kids out there out playing outside, fricking whack jobs
Speaker 3: And nothing. Get back to me. It took an hour. And
Speaker 2: Well, how about, um, education, you know, elementary, middle school, uh, did your kids go to public school throughout? Like
Speaker 3: What was your, they did, so we start, well, actually we started download private school road at first with our oldest and then we moved out here and we got kind of, my wife got involved with moms club Warrington. Yeah. All of them [00:30:30] are a lot, still are friends today and then found out a lot about what we had heard even out here. Oh, you know, you got to take your kids to private school, all that's nonsense, I think. Yeah. And then, so the kid, we had some, my son went to Highland for a couple years, but then they all went through the, the public school system here. And I think it's, it's a good one. Yeah. And um, I think they did really well too. I'm amazed, especially in the high school level, how advanced [00:31:00] the kids are. And I mean, really both, you know, not only academically, but just being able to like carry on a discussion and give presentations, they do stuff. And maybe that's generally now that we, I don't remember doing in high school. Yeah. And you know, some of my son's and daughter's friends that come over and I'm like, I'm talking to an adult and they're like, you know, in 10th grade, it's just, it's kinda, I think that's a reflection of what, you know, some of the school system or the school system here does is [00:31:30] preparing our kids for, for real life. But yeah. They all sort of went through the, basically the public school system.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. That's a, that's an awesome review. I appreciate that. My wife's a elementary school, a public school teacher actually, she's working on Highland right now, but you look at education as, I guess I think of it is, you know, your biggest education is what you're doing with your kids outside of school. You know, teaching them how to be a human and then the numbers and letters and stuff like that. They all figure out over time. But [00:32:00] the presentations are things that are wonderful, but to think about spending 20, 30, 40, $50,000 a year on school, thinking how much does the best teacher on the planet have to get paid to come be? My kid's personal teacher, we did get six like-minded individuals and pay a teacher 250 grand a year and have the best education you could possibly imagine in three hours a day. Right. And, uh, I don't know, I'm, I'm all over the place with education, [00:32:30] but, uh, all, all three of your kids, both of them go to college or you got Stratton in college. Chloe's at JMU
Speaker 3: Now Chloe's at Belmont. So yeah. So I have two in college now Stratton's or always at Belmont university in Nashville. Stratton's at east Carolina and my daughter is still in 10th grade at Forcier.
Speaker 2: Does she anticipate going to college?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah. Yeah. So she's probably in my other kids. Won't mind me saying that she's the smartest of the bunch. So she's already kind of researching [00:33:00] and we're pushing Virginia schools in state tuition, but she, you know, she's talking like Oxford and at this age, but anyway, she definitely won't be going to college. And uh, anyway,
Speaker 2: Do you, do they know what they want to do? Or they have an
Speaker 3: Idea? Yeah. So the funny thing, this is probably a topic talking about, the funny thing is all my two oldest are sort of following what we did. So yeah. Chloe's interior design major and strands and construction management major. Yeah. So [00:33:30] he's, um, you know, we're, I'm third generation of that. So the thoughts are, we'll have a fourth generation, which would be kind of cool.
Speaker 2: Yeah. You think they'll come in under the, under boa under, under day.
Speaker 3: I think one of them's Stratton's going to intern and Chloe me in turn with us too and work out of our Tyson's office, which has a lot, you know, big infrastructure and they can kind of get a taste of what, what it is, um, to, to work in that industry. But yeah, I think they'll, they'll kind of fall into that.
Speaker 2: [00:34:00] How do you envision your role as a parent changing? You know, it's changed several times because a eight year old is different than a 16 year old is different than a 22 year old. Like how's your being a father
Speaker 3: Evolved. Yeah. We've talked, we talked a little bit about that before in that, in that now I remember my oldest it's become kind of like mentor slash friend role because they're off doing their stuff. I can't tell them what to do anymore. Right. To a point. Right. And with my youngest, I'm still dad, [00:34:30] you know, so it's, um, it, I have to put like one foot in the, in the younger parenting and one foot in more of the adult and kind of be there for them. One thing that we want to do definitely is as they grow and in, certainly in go through the college years is not, is not hover too much on them and let them make their own decisions. And that'll include the successes and the mistakes too. And just, um, you know, that's the only way they're going to learn. So we're, we try to [00:35:00] do that.
Speaker 2: And as they get older and you find yourself more in like a mentorship role friend role, like what you think you're going to miss most about, you know, being more of the parent.
Speaker 3: I missed the, um, we really it's funny. Cause now we know Halena has her friends that still came over. But before we had three kids sets of friends, so our house was like the house where all the kids were at. And then suddenly that went away. I mean, we have Halena still has her friends [00:35:30] over, so we can't wait until those kids come over, but we miss that. Like we miss the Hey Mr. Burch know, I never
Speaker 2: Ever have any Twizzlers left in your pantry, get some kid Aiden.
Speaker 3: Okay. Let's all Stratton's friends call me like big red and all this. So I like miss all that and stuff, but you know, it's the way life is. And it's, it's fun to see them go out and sort of making their own memories. And, and we, that's a theme also we have is like, you know, we do, when they're all around, we're kind of like, all right, well, [00:36:00] what can we do that? They're going to remember. So, you know, make some memories today. Let's make some memories today.
Speaker 2: That's awesome. That's, that's what I think that's the answer. Yeah. We talked about that a little bit already, but it's a good opportunity to talk about the stuff that you're doing now, because I don't know if you were doing that, you know, over the course of time when you had three kids in the house, like the radio show that you do, you know, that you're sponsored a ski race, which is awesome. So like you find you, is that [00:36:30] replacing that time or,
Speaker 3: I mean, I think there's definitely more time to do that. Now. It would have been hard to do it with three kids at home and juggling all of the schedules and things and just spending time with them. Yeah. You definitely have more time to, to devote to yourself. I think, I mean, all kinds of ways and levels. We're really cognizant of not to, to make too much where we're getting kind of selfish and just doing stuff for ourselves. Meaning like, you know, here's a trip we could plan on doing together, [00:37:00] but we also have one take the kids somewhere else. We sort of still keep that as the number one thing. And I think you have to kind of do that until they're off on their own and, and, you know, having their families and you know, my wife talks about things and I'm like, you know, where are we going to move? Where they're going to want to bring kids back their kids, you know, she's already thinking of it. I'm like, I don't even notice college. Yeah. Let's just wait a little bit and you never know what's going to happen. Just let's just wait.
Speaker 2: Well, it just goes to show how like kids centric, you guys are like how [00:37:30] important your kids are to you, which is, this is one of my favorite questions I might have asked it to you the other day. But do you think that your kids will understand how much you love them until they have kids? Like, can your kid love you back as much as you love them?
Speaker 3: Yeah. That's a good question. I think they can and are, I mean, our, our kids definitely say that like, you know, I love you and that kind of stuff, which is that's great. But until you, like, I really realized what I put my parents through [00:38:00] when I had kids and my kids, you know, were going through whatever it was. And I, I definitely had a better appreciation. So I think they probably does grow when they, when they sort of get into that and realize, wow, this is what I,
Speaker 2: The aha moment. Yeah. My mom used to say, when I was a little kid, you know, I throw myself in front of a bus for you. Right. It's like, that's, it's pretty violent, but you know, that's the high school kid. But now that I have kids, I'm like, yeah, you would. I know you would. Yeah.
Speaker 3: [00:38:30] I believe that now. Yeah. I mean, I think that's until you experience a lot of stuff, we didn't in your life, you got to come of experience to understand what someone else's shoes.
Speaker 2: If only they had had kids, they wouldn't have been so in like high school for whatever.
Speaker 3: Uh, we have like another saying, you know, I'm always like you use my gray hair knowledge. Like when they say something and I'm like, no, no, no, no, you don't want to do those. No, man, I know this is what this, I can do it. I'm like, look, I've done all this I've I went through the rough [00:39:00] Rocky road for you. Don't do this. And you know, at some point they have to just experience their own stuff anyway. And yeah.
Speaker 2: And learn from it. Context is so different now, you know, my Rocky road is different than your Rocky road. Just the nature of being 15 years difference than another 15 years to your kids is so different. I see why parents forget that. Yeah. You know, this is what I did. So this is what you should do. Well, the world is different. The environment is different. So that [00:39:30] action breeds a different reaction. And so we were kind of, I found a lot of humility realizing that I'm clueless about what they're going through. I got
Speaker 3: A 1% of it. I mean, even though, I mean, you probably experienced this because you're in business with your dad too. So, you know, my dad sometimes will say, uh, you know, this is my dad. Did we stopped doing that? Like 20 years ago? He got, no, no, no. This is the way no, you don't understand. And it's that. Oh yeah, that does make sense. But it's funny. Cause [00:40:00] you know, the time to teach the teacher, I mean, you have those moments when my kids do that, to me, all the, my, especially with like electronics and things like that, we get all of that stuff. So we have, you know, for what I do, I get exposed to a lot of like high fidelity or smart home stuff. I can't, oh, have you hear any of that out? So we, you know, suppliers will give me this stuff and I just give it to my son. Hey, can you set this up? Tell me, just [00:40:30] giving them a controller at the end. Show me how to do it. I have no clue.
Speaker 2: 45 buttons. Show me the two important ones play stop. And sir that's so, uh, what are some of the milestones you think about as a parent looking back?
Speaker 3: Well, certainly, you know, our, our first milestone when the kids were born in sort of the sort of initial problems they had in kind of getting over that physically, that was a big thing that sort of set [00:41:00] in motion, how we parented and how we, um, thought of our kids. And so that's certainly a milestone. And then all the, um, the ha you know, I've been lucky enough to experience two high school graduations now, to which, you know, I was, I was actually amazed how much that not amazed, but surprised how emotional I got during that. Like that was like, kind of like up in the stands, sort of hiding, hiding back tears because it's just like, wow, you [00:41:30] know, this is, you sort of see all their whole life flash really quick. And then there, they are up on stage getting their diplomas and, and kind of going off and dropping kids off at college.
Speaker 3: Oh, that's yeah. You know, that was tough. And I, I actually believe it or not tend to be the more emotional one. Mellon's a stronger one when it comes to that. But yeah, it was, I mean, it's so awesome though. I mean, it's, it's emotional, but it's like good emotion, even if you're sorta sad, it's like seeing them do things. So all of those, [00:42:00] those things have been great. All my kids played sports, so I LA I have a bunch of memories of them doing that. And, you know, I think, um, I think it was good for them to sort of experience all that well-roundedness and, and things. So we remember those, those things. And then just, we also remember dumb stuff, like my son and I building a garden and in our side yard, like that kind of stuff. And I think if I was to put my hand [00:42:30] on it, I mean, those are the kinds of things I remember most is those little things that sort of stand out. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Did you get much opportunity with three kids like this? Did you carve out time to spend one-on-one or spend a lot of time together as group?
Speaker 3: We tried, we tried to do that. And you know, with three kids with two it's, it's easy to do with three it's, like three is the magic number is everything comes in threes and yeah. And I, Melanie and I realized that we [00:43:00] weren't spending as much alone time with our youngest. It's weird that you just brought that up because we did like, have like, whoa, wait a minute. And then we would have, you know, I would have Halena and dad lunches and we go to like Wegmans or something and sit down and talk for a while. But when the, when we got two kids, it was sort of managed. You can manage that when Halina was our youngest was younger, she sorta just tagged along with everyone. And then she got older and became her own person. And she was still [00:43:30] sort of tagging along like, wait a minute, we need to spend some time with her too. Yeah. So we tried to, yeah,
Speaker 2: That's awesome. I, uh, my, my daughter, I think convinced the staff at her school today that she was sick. Pretty sure she wasn't. Cause she,
Speaker 3: They told him to spend some time,
Speaker 2: You know, long story short, I got to spend just two hours with her at home. And it's like, we haven't, I don't remember the last time I did this, you know, just with her. And it was totally by accident, but what a blessing it was to, you know, even if it was distracted, [00:44:00] I was working and she was playing we'd overlap for 15 or 20 minutes at a time. And just giggle and tickle, tickle. She's a ticket. She tried to tickle me while I'm trying to where right. Come on.
Speaker 3: If there's, again, there's a little moments, you know, those that's what makes a life and makes the memories and the, you know, my kids, I can't even think specifically. One of them said to me the other day, one of my, I think it was Stratton. Cause when we were, we were just there for one, it was lacrosse games and Carolina, he said something like, oh yeah, I remember that. And it was some [00:44:30] like random from like 10 years ago with just him and I, and he brought it up and I'm like, how do you even remember that? But like that was like right at the immense something so cool. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So what are some milestones looking forward that you're excited to experience?
Speaker 3: You know, definitely there, I have two that are kind of growing into two kids that are growing into themselves. You know, as far as, I mean they're mature, they're in college and then they're going to be off doing their own careers. I'm [00:45:00] looking forward to that. I'm really looking forward to see Halena, our youngest, where she's gonna end up going to school. Cause she's really, I mean, she's already figured out like, you know, looking at schools already and like she wants to be a writer she wants to do. I mean, she's kinda like got, she's thinking, it's like she makes her goals and sheets and stuff already. And then of course, you know, eventually not to sane, but having grandkids and stuff like that will be fun. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I've never, I've never seen my parents light up the way they do, uh, with [00:45:30] the grand babies running around. Yeah. That's like you said, not too soon. I'm already excited about it.
Speaker 3: My, uh, my oldest has a boyfriend that she's been with a while and we really like him. But when you say, Hey, what you guys are way too deep, the way it's going now, you know? But anyway, we do look forward to that. And I think Melanie, especially like I told you, I mean, she's thinking about that already
Speaker 2: And have to be the disciplinarian. She gets to be the, shake them up [00:46:00] and give them back
Speaker 3: And we'll see if that works.
Speaker 2: Oh man. So let's see. What's uh, what's uh, some qualities about your kids that you're particularly really, uh, proud of.
Speaker 3: All of my kids are really thoughtful. And um, one thing we can't, we, another thing we sort of talked about when they were really young is like, if you see another kid that's in distress or getting bullied [00:46:30] or something like that to stand up for them. Yeah. Cause both, both Melanie and I had like a, you know, I have red hair, so I was bullied as a kid and I know how that feels and, and all of our kids are really thoughtful when it comes to that. Yeah. And they've taken, I've seen each one in a different way. Take their friends who maybe there's a kid that they're hanging out with is having some problems and sort of like bring him into the mix or her into the mix with the other group. And I'm really proud of that. [00:47:00] They're both, they're all very sort of artistic in their own way. And we both, Molly and I are both are too. So we, we love that about them and they're all seem to be getting into the family business, which is great.
Speaker 2: Cool. I can see on your face how much that means to you. That's really cool. How about any attributes as a father that you're particularly proud of that you felt like helped you raise kids?
Speaker 3: Uh, for me, I think I tend to try to in life, in stay level [00:47:30] headed, I think most people that know me, like it takes me a lot, a lot to get me angry and I can, I try to be the one that can calm people down. So as a, as a parent, I liked that attribute that I can kinda whatever's going on. I can, they know they can come to me and sort of just say, all right, wait a minute. Let's just chill out and talk about this for a second. And I liked that.
Speaker 2: I think that makes you that way. Is that like something that you practice to become that way or you think you were just kind of boring?
Speaker 3: No, I definitely practice [00:48:00] that, that in my younger years I did a bunch of meditation and things to get like that when I first got into college, I suffered from panic attacks. Oh wow. Yeah. And so I was forced to it for anyone that's ever had panic attacks. It's nothing to be ashamed of. It's something that just like out of me, it was a physical thing that just sort of happened, but it then mentally it takes over and you start going, man, am I dying? What's going on? And you have to learn how to, to manage that. So how I did with, I [00:48:30] read a bunch of books about it and practice meditation and got into a bunch of stuff from there that gave me sort of a bigger picture, a read a lot of Joseph Campbell, if you know, and sort of, you know, we're not, we're so small in the universe that, you know, there's no reason to get upset about stuff really. Yeah. And that sort of change. I had like a sort of a Tiffany, if you will, in my twenties, early twenties stuff sort of changed for me in that I don't, it doesn't take, and I've been through [00:49:00] some stuff in my wife for sure. Both professionally and other things, but I don't get, you know, I can manage it pretty well. So I liked
Speaker 2: Attributes. Is that like a structured part of you every single day? Like non-negotiable
Speaker 3: Not, so I don't meditate every day now, but I try to do something for myself. Like I know you're doing your pull-up challenge. So I'm doing this. Like every month I try to pick up something like that. So I have like a crunch challenge and it's stupid, but [00:49:30] it's physical and it gets me not thinking about other stuff. And then if I do that, I can like manage all the things, you know, whatever it is, ride your bike, go hiking or whatever. We do a lot of outdoor stuff outdoors for me, sort of makes everything else. Okay. Like if I can get out and get some breeze, some fresh air and, you know, experience something, look at something cool. And the rest of my day goes much better than if I don't. If I get stuck at the desk all day looking at stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah. There's something super grounding about [00:50:00] it. Like just take your shoes off and just stand on the earth for a little bit. It's amazing. Exactly. And I think people discount the physical too. Like what it does to your mind, meditation in a lot of ways is described as being, you know, relieving your mind if it's thoughts or trying to get in between the thoughts or whatever. And if you're moving in different ways, you're exposing your brain to action in diff in a different way. Absolutely. And I think I see why people get addicted to exercise because it's not all physical, [00:50:30] there's so much of it as mental. So, um, I appreciate that so much. Yeah. So, uh, I wanna jump into kind of one of my, what I like to call kind of the lightning round. Sure. What are three qualities or characteristics that you think would make up? Uh, a super dad
Speaker 3: Understanding. I think being, understanding, being calm and at the same time being authoritative and new authority and [00:51:00] sort of weighing the rules out.
Speaker 2: So actually in that thought and what you were saying earlier, is there a book that you'd recommend to today?
Speaker 3: I mean, there's a bunch of self-help books I'm trying to, so I read one, I want
Speaker 2: To limit you to one. If
Speaker 3: You've got two or three, well, there is, but this is a good one. I think it's, um, care of the soul. I don't know if you've ever, and I'm forgetting who the Thomas somebody is, the author, but you can find it. This is an older, this is back when I was [00:51:30] a young dad, no 20 in my twenties, but that really sort of, it's not about parenting, but it sort of lays the groundwork I think, and how to be know when to be disciplined and when not to be in the, let people make their own mistakes. And yeah, and because there's so much as a parent, not just parenting, it's interacting with other parents and you know, not being the guy at the baseball field he's wants to fight the ref because [00:52:00] he made a bad call for your daughter. You know, whatever. I mean, there's a bunch of lessons that, that book, that was one of the books that I read that sort of set me on my path to be sort of a relaxed parent, I guess I would call myself
Speaker 2: My mindful deliberate.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Okay. So w how about some things that are on your not to do list as a parent, that if you, if you did it, you felt horrible, but, or wish you hadn't put some something you're so glad you never did.
Speaker 3: [00:52:30] I'm glad that I, so I do have some friends that never go to any of their kids' stuff. And whether that's something, you know, a play in school or a band recital or a soccer game or whatever it is, you know, you, you have to never do that. You have to be involved in what your kids do. So I'm glad that I was never not involved.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I feel like it's selfish of me to go back. I want to be there. Okay.
Speaker 3: Um, like sometimes they do, like, you don't have to go, [00:53:00] no, I
Speaker 2: Want to, I really do want to, this is not about
Speaker 3: You. So I played my, I had this conversation with my mom recently, so I played high school basketball and, you know, in high school you want to be like the cool guy. And my mom was the mom that was like the bleachers, like Screaming at people like the whole team and look back like, oh man. But now I kind of get it. I'm like, all right,
Speaker 2: How do we get our high school kids to be okay with that? That's
Speaker 3: [00:53:30] So funny.
Speaker 2: Oh man. So what's a, what's a way that you think you can continue to improve as a father.
Speaker 3: It's a, you know, I'm in the next stage. So I'm not, I'm not in the same stage as say you are, what you can learn at your stage is so much more advanced and think there's so much more stuff there now. So I'm in the stage where my kids are getting older and I just want to learn how to deal with that, whatever that is. I mean, I, I still read a lot [00:54:00] on that kind of stuff or listen to podcasts. That's actually, I'd probably do more of that. Yeah. Ted talks on, you know, how to, how to deal with that kind of stuff. And yeah. Just life in general. Not be to not take everything too seriously. I think that's sort of the next thing I want to learn is how to just kind of roll with whatever is going to come. Yeah. Because there's going to be a lot of changes happening in my life soon. You know, as far as my kids go graduating college, starting careers, getting married, you know, kid [00:54:30] grandkids, hopefully, and all that. And just sort of how to sail through that. And
Speaker 2: It's cool that you're actively pursuing that information on like self reflection, self expansion and, and just, you know, self-awareness and yeah, I'm grateful to be continuing to meet more people that are that way. But I, I don't find that everybody is that
Speaker 3: I don't, you know, I think it's more than it used to be because it was more, there's more avenues to get that information with, with the internet [00:55:00] and all the stuff that using it. You'd have to read a book. And a lot of people don't like to report. I don't really like to read sure. But I do it because there's some, you know, I want to get the information, but now I can like pop it in when I'm in traffic or whatever. And I think there's more opportunity, but yeah. So I try to tell anyone that's struggling with that kind of stuff. Hey, there's a bunch of information you can listen to and, and, you know, learn from whatever it is.
Speaker 2: The, what do you think is the role of a father?
Speaker 3: I think the role [00:55:30] of a father maybe is to be a example for your kids, you know, that you can get into parenting and rules laying the authoritative figure and whatever, but, you know, being an example of what your kid, your kids are going to mimic what you do. Yeah. Um, and I think I told you that three year period where I was like, you know, not around as much, like not really, because my oldest was, that was her in formative years when she [00:56:00] was like watching what I was doing. Yeah. So it's, you know, you have to be, you have to be cognizant that your kids are watching you all the time and they will end up doing exactly what you do if that's what they're exposed to.
Speaker 2: I believe that. So what is your biggest fear as a dad?
Speaker 3: Yeah. That one of them would get hurt somehow. Yeah,
Speaker 2: Of course. How about greatest hope for your
Speaker 3: Kids, but they're happy. Happy. Yeah. You know, I used to, even personally, I used [00:56:30] to think like being successful and money and all that stuff was what would define that, but not anymore. Like I like my, I secretly want to be a park ranger. Yeah. I mean, seriously, that's what, that's my dream job. So whatever my kids, like my daughter, he's, you know, interior designs doing flow painting. Now, if you know what that is like pores paint over and she's selling it online. She's like, dad, I can, I could do this, you know, as a thing. And I'm like, I'm thinking back in my mind, I try [00:57:00] to do that. And it was, you can't make a living, but I'm like, whatever she wants to do, you know, as long as she's happy.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Then the context is they're sold on the internet. So, you know, Gary Vaynerchuk says, if you're into Smurfs, you can make a real living on smarter.
Speaker 3: But that, I mean, that's the big thing is because I, you know, my business, I see a lot of people that have a lot of money. That's spent a lot of money on stupid stuff that doesn't make any sense and they're not happy. Yeah. So I'd rather my kids just to be happy, [00:57:30] whatever they're doing. So who,
Speaker 2: Who's your favorite TV dad?
Speaker 3: Geez. That's a good question. I'm not going to say bill Cosby. Hmm. No, I don't even know. Yeah. I don't watch that much of that stuff. I watch a lot of his Alaskan shows that his adventure shows and one of the dads it's on one of those, it's pretty cool. It makes us kids work. And I feel like experiencing something. So I don't know.
Speaker 2: Oh, that's cool. Uh, [00:58:00] if you're going to write a book about your professional and personal life, you know, biography, what would be some of the, as a parent professional, what are some of the names of the chapters that might be in it?
Speaker 3: Um, jeez, the Renaissance for sure. The dark days. I mean the, you know, you name it, I've sort of said my, you know, not to get into too much detail, but you know, I've had up and downs in my career and in sort of got through [00:58:30] all of them and up and downs in my parenting too. So I think I could run the full gamut, but for the past 10 years, plus I felt really good about where we're all at. So yeah. I think it's, you know, lessons learned would be one of them, for sure. Like it.
Speaker 2: Yeah. How would you describe the kind of father you'd like to be remembered
Speaker 3: As like the tombstone thing?
Speaker 2: Sure.
Speaker 3: Here's one on your
Speaker 2: Team's time.
Speaker 3: [00:59:00] Like understanding for me, that would be a big thing.
Speaker 2: I think that's a cool one. And then, um, Tim Ferris does a podcast and he asked this question, what message would you put on a billboard? And I like to say, what message would you put a bill on a billboard that all the dads on 95 read, you got that much space to deliver your message.
Speaker 3: Your kids are watching.
Speaker 2: I love it. All right. So [00:59:30] this is my last question. So in the event that this recording lasts for forever and you've got your kids, kids, kids, kids, kids, they all get to hear it. What would you say to them?
Speaker 3: Uh, I never stopped learning. I never stopped trying to be a good person. And that meant dad, grandfather great-grandfather to. Yeah. Um, I think that, and that would be the, the lesson [01:00:00] I would give them is no matter how old you are to never stop learning. And we have a, we have a little thing in our family, so my grandfather were Norwegian on one side of the family. So my grandfather was full-blooded came over from Norway and won he skied. But not like you would think in Norwegian would ski. He was kind of like a beginner, intermediate skier. Yeah. So I was skiing [01:00:30] with him when he was like 92. Yeah. In Vermont. And I remember we were like, we were like coming down. It was the end of the day. And he fell in front of me and he stood up and I saw his whole nose was bleeding.
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh my God, did he break something? It's 92. I'm like, grandpa, you okay. He's like, hurry. We got to get back down before the lift closes, we can get one more run. And he was like, you know, here was so old, but he wanted to like practice his turns, you know, to get better. [01:01:00] And he was so happy. Cause he was so old, it gave him season passes everywhere for free. So that's sort of like, you know, no matter how, whatever you're doing or how far along you think you are in your career or parenting or whatever still is always so much more to learn. That's awesome. And that would be what I would say. Just never stop learning stuff.
Speaker 2: That'd be very pleased to say that to my kids, kids, kids, kids, kids. Cool. Awesome. Well, thanks a lot, man. You bet. So
Speaker 3: It's fun. Yeah.