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Learning to Dad with Tyler Ross 023 - Christopher Campbell

Speaker 2: Hello. Welcome to [00:00:30] learning to dad. My name is Tyler Ross, and today I'm here with Chris Campbell. Thanks for being here. Yeah.

Speaker 3: And this is great. Really appreciate it. Uh, been looking forward to coming on this for a while. This is a, I think we would try to do this for a few months now, but I keep a running and things like overtime.

Speaker 2: Yep. Yup. Well, I remember specifically meeting you for the first time. I don't know if you remember this week. I was in line getting ready to at the town hall, getting ready to speak on behalf of the Walker drive project. [00:01:00] And we got to chat briefly and I immediately found you to be like super welcoming and kind, and then the more I get to know you, you're just freaking interesting. I mean like so much that we've talked about, like there's so much more, cause I was looking through your Facebook feed and I'm like, all right, you got two boys. I know you've talked about being in finance before they've talked about racing motorcycles or dirt bikes. I saw that you were nominated for a life saving award as you're working the [00:01:30] warrant and police departments. You're a pastor. And I did not know, but apparently you're hell on the drums to

Speaker 3: Play drums every now and again.

Speaker 2: But yeah, that's what I know. And then on top of that, and one of the times we get together often for this boys and girls club, Christmas thing that Lindsay and forced in and I get, and that you've been so gracious to participate in. And when you started talking to those kids in a group, I was just in awe, the way that you commanded their attention in such a, [00:02:00] I don't even know how to describe it. Like I, I don't, I feel like I don't have that in me. It was you, you ease and just know how to speak to them on their level. And I was just totally inspired by that.

Speaker 3: I appreciate the, I appreciate the kind words. And, uh, man, it's been, since I moved up here from Harrison or used to live in Shenandoah county, moved up here from Harrisonburg in about 2008, 2009. And man, the, this, the opportunities to get involved in the community here have just been unbelievable. Um, so I've, I've made it [00:02:30] a point in my life to really make the most out of every single opportunity. And if I'm going to do something, I'm going to give it a hundred percent while I'm doing it, you know, best I can. And it's just been, it's served me well. And man, the opportunities just keep coming. I love it. I have a blast. I try to have just a fun life and you have to my line of work, you just got to have fun. So

Speaker 2: Yeah, this was coming from somebody who was shot in your lineup.

Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. That was a quiet, quiet nor deal. Uh we're we're coming up on [00:03:00] a year now. Yeah. It's coming up on a year since that happened and uh, very thankful for, um, the community that, that really rallied behind me and my family when we were going through all that scary time don't ever recommend don't ever recommend getting shot. It, uh, it doesn't feel too good.

Speaker 2: Well, I was following it in the paper really, before I got to know you and still getting to know you, but I'm looking forward to having that conversation with you. One how it impacted your life because it's such a traumatic, you know, it, it [00:03:30] peaks, you know, it spikes the meter in a lifetime and then also just clear up some gospel, what people said happened, who it happened to, where it happened. So it'd be, it'd be interesting to talk about. So as you know, the purpose of this podcast is to talk to people that I perceive to be really good parents and also really great and dedicated at what they do in their job and finding the, the ideas that allow people to try to do that.

Speaker 3: Oh, fantastic. Yeah. Um, [00:04:00] um, insanely humbled that you thought of me and very thankful, man. And, uh, that means a lot. So I'll, hopefully it give you, give you a little bit, uh, insight in how I do things and man, I keep learning. Oh yeah.

Speaker 2: Yeah. I believe he had nothing but wonderful things to share and people draw a lot from this. I'm already confident, but I like to start with a little bit of background. So you, you grew up in Harrisonburg, Shenandoah county, like you were there until you were how old

Speaker 3: I moved up here at 23. [00:04:30] Uh, yes, I born and raised in, in, uh, a little place called where's cave. It's about 10 miles south of Harrisonburg. Everyone knows Harrisonburg cause JMU grew up. I got two little brothers and the oldest of two little brothers and, uh, I had a great childhood man. I really can't. I, I w I wish and hope and pray that I can give my kids the same childhood I had because I had just, I had everything, man. I had, uh, we raced motorcycles. I played drums, uh, you know, had parents that fed us and supported us and [00:05:00] took us to the lake every weekend to, uh, you know, go jet skiing and tubing. And it was just a blast, had a really, really, really good childhood. And, uh, you know, um, it, things happen. You know, my parents ended up separating towards the end of my high school year.

Speaker 3: And, you know, basically I had a ride to go to Liberty university to play drums. I was very involved with my church, uh, and, and I wasn't able to go after my parents split. So I ended up staying back in Harrisonburg instead of going to Liberty at [00:05:30] 17, I graduated 17 blue Ridge Powersports, uh, gave me a full-time job as a salesman there, uh, learning how to talk to people properly. And, uh, and really I'm grateful at that age because I learned how to manage money. I learned how to speak confidently to people and communicate and work on those communication skills. But at the same time, it was tough. You know, my, you know, after my parents left, I stayed at the house. It was me and my brother and I worked full-time to basically keep the place afloat. [00:06:00] I paid the mortgage, you know, uh, pay the electricity bills.

Speaker 3: Um, and there were times where he, and I would sit around eating Mac and cheese in the dark because we couldn't afford to turn the electricity bill on. And then those were tough times at 17, 18 years old. And, uh, I think that's kinda out of that, those hardships. I think that's really what drove me till to what I am today and why I approach things the way I approach things. Cause I, I never want to go back to that point. I never want to go back to that [00:06:30] time where I'm like, you know, sitting on a floor in the dark because I can't afford to do it. And, you know, and, and really it it's, it's really pushed me to want to help people that may be in that position. Do you don't have people help you? Not really. I mean, I had the people at, uh, at, at, at my work that were obviously supportive of, of me and trying to, you know, help me, me out as much as they could.

Speaker 3: And, and I said, man, I owe them a lot, but, uh, [00:07:00] you know, everything ended up working out, you know, if you're you're a few years after that, um, got a great relationship with both my parents now and, uh, brothers are doing really well. They're all still back in Harrisonburg, but I met charity, my wife, she was a student at JMU when I was a, at a church down there helping out, we got together. And then, uh, I came up here to help her dad, uh, launch a church, new hope church. They meet over at, uh, Highland school now on Sundays. Oh man, she's packed. Yeah. And, uh, five by five, uh, did that for about five years [00:07:30] and it was great. And, uh, man, I just, since like, I don't know, early teens, I just felt this like called a work in law enforcement and I couldn't, I ran from it for years.

Speaker 3: Yeah. You know? Um, I would, uh, and then I would try a little bit and then it wouldn't work out. I wouldn't get into the agency. I was trying to get to and I kept trying and kept trying and kept trying it just wasn't working. And so I never gave up, I mean, it was like I applied from two different agencies from 2008 to [00:08:00] 2015, you know, and then gave up in 2015 and then was like, finally like, okay, you know what, I'm just gonna let this go. This is a dream that just didn't happen. And I remember sitting in the hospital at RMH after my first son was born. And, uh, I remember he was sitting, you know, he was in his little bassinet brand new baby and I'm in the corner. Just, I couldn't get it out of my head that I needed to fill out one more application [00:08:30] and that did.

Speaker 3: And so everything started working out real well. Uh, and I got an opportunity with Warrington and it has just been a blast since man. And, and, and I think that I may not have been ready back in 2008, 2009. So keep learning and, and, and I think what it is is it just all built up. So whenever I got the opportunity, the flood gates opened and I just let, let the town have everything that I could give it, you know, and, and really tried really, really, really hard [00:09:00] to do everything I can to be a sponge, to mentors around me, but also do what I can to help elevate everyone else around me too. So,

Speaker 2: Um, I want to jump back a minute from 17 to 23, he had a wonderful childhood new, forgive me if I'm reading too much into what you said, but you said you get along with both of your parents now, was there a period of time in there where that wasn't the case?

Speaker 3: That was tough. I mean, well, and, and, you know, I won't go too far [00:09:30] into it, but, uh, yeah, I mean, there was a, there was a time period for about, uh, shoot four or five years where I didn't talk to my dad. Didn't talk to my dad. A lot of things happened in the background that the people don't really need to know about, but some things happen. And of course, you know, that rock my relationship with him. Didn't talk to him, you know? Um, I felt like almost like mom kind of abandoned us a little bit, you know, and, and I just felt abandoned, you know, and it was unfair probably a little bit, [00:10:00] uh, to feel that way, because I know that my parents were trying. Yeah. Um, but I was so mad at the situation. It was just, I channeled it, you know, and, and I turned everything I had to work.

Speaker 3: He was like, okay, you know what? I gotta be a man. Now, if they're not here to help, you know, this is what I'm going to do, I'm going to buckle down and I'm going to grow up, be a man and put the big boy pants on and just, and just do it. And, um, and that worked out really well for me. It really did. I mean, it developed [00:10:30] me into, I would say kind of a type, a personality, but an empathetic one. And it just gave me, it gave me the drive and the work ethic that I needed to help push me to where I am now.

Speaker 2: So I don't know that they're going to be a lot of 17 to 23 year olds listening to this podcast. But if, if I could ask you to put yourself as that person again, is there anything that, you know, parents who are not reconciled with their kids or, you know, having an experience like that, is there anything that you would have liked to hear [00:11:00] from your parents that maybe another parent could say to their kids to try to close the gap and start a relationship?

Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely. No. And, and that's an, that's a great, that's a great question to ask. Basically if I, if I could encourage parents to do anything, it is so hard as a parent. And I'm thinking this now as a parent, but it was so hard as a parent of maybe a parent of a, of a teen to humble yourself enough to look them in the eye and [00:11:30] say, I made a mistake. You know, that's like, I can't imagine what that would be like, you put myself in my parent's shoes to do that, but that's what I needed at that time. You know, eventually I got it, you know, and, uh, you

Speaker 2: Ready? You were ready to

Speaker 3: Hear it. Yeah. And, and, uh, I think I was ready to hear it throughout that whole thing, but I don't know that they were ready to give it, see what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: You think parents that have that kind of with their kid or lack of relationship as a result of pride or just not knowing?

Speaker 3: I [00:12:00] honestly think my parents felt like they let us down. And I think that, that, and maybe some embarrassment there, I think that, uh, definitely some pride, you know, my dad is, is, is a great man who will do anything for anyone. Yeah. You know, one thing that I though, I think he's always struggled with is putting himself first. Right. You know, that being said, I think there is just one part of him that, that he does keep to himself, you know? And, and that's some of that pride and, and, uh, I think it's [00:12:30] tough. I think it's tough for him to, to, uh, humble himself and, and really it's a hurtful thing for, for everyone involved, all of it, that whole thing was just extremely hurtful. So we, as humans, we run from hurt, fight or flight. Right. So we, we run from it. It's easier to just take it slow, go day by day, you know, and think to ourselves, okay, well, we'll work on this over time. But I think the thing that was the worst was days turned into weeks, weeks, turned into months, months, turns into years [00:13:00] and you lose all that time. So

Speaker 2: Parents who told them do it now do

Speaker 3: It. Now don't wait. I mean, it is going to be so hard, but, and also don't, don't, don't worry about asking for outside counsel, like I'm a huge fan of counseling. Yeah. Bring someone else in that you guys trust that can sit down with you and have those hard conversations. You, your children, I mean, that's blood man, and that's the most important thing, you know, to, to have those conversations and open up those avenues of [00:13:30] communication so that you can reconcile so that you can have those relationships that I think a mother, son, mother, father, you know, father, son should have, you know, and, uh, and that's what I only hope to do with my kids is keep, you know, keep encouraging them, keep loving them, you know, and keep supporting them emotionally, as much as I can to

Speaker 2: When I was about, I want to say 16 or 17, might've been 15. I had a breakthrough with my dad and it came with tears and a lot [00:14:00] of crying. And did you have that experience when you reconciled with yourself about I'm getting it vulnerability and masculinity and generational differences? Like my dad's dad was different than my dad is different than me. Like yeah.

Speaker 3: For me, it was a, there was a point and I want to say, I want to say it was probably oh seven. You know, my dad turned to alcohol right after the divorce, you know, in oh four. So he, he got pretty involved with, with, with the bottle, oh 6 0 7. [00:14:30] He almost died. Liver failure. They found him unconscious in his apartment. I mean, I remember going to the hospital and seeing him in there and he was yellow and that's what happens kind of whenever you have liver failure and you got alcohol and, and you know, life support and the whole thing. So I think that at that point it was like, it was like, okay, this is, this is just this real, there is no more days. There is no more weeks. There is no more months. There is no more years. I mean, it is like right now we got to fix this because I mean, he's going to die, [00:15:00] you know?

Speaker 3: And, and I don't want to personally, I don't want to live the rest of my life knowing that okay. I could have helped foster that too. Yeah. You know, it takes everyone, it takes people on both sides, really perfect relationships. Aren't one, you know, 50, 50 they're 100, 100, you know, sometimes it's going to be 80, 20. Sometimes it's going to be 90 10. You know, sometimes it's going to be zero 100. But, uh, yeah, that, and that was it for us. I mean, after that happened, I mean, it was [00:15:30] like, we started to open up avenues and it was like, Hey, you know, it's like, Hey dad, how are you doing? You know, how you feel better, blah, blah, blah. And then, then that turns into laughing and joking around. And then that turns into reminiscing and then it just, it works.

Speaker 2: That's awesome. So jumping back to where you were leading up to filling out that last application, what do you think was the obstacle for those five years?

Speaker 3: Well, I mean, I think just in real practical senses, there were, [00:16:00] there was a time where I've got a letter. I still keep from the state police because I really want to go work for state police. And it was, uh, due to the current economic client climate, uh, you know, cause back in oh eight and oh nine, everyone was on a hiring freeze. And I think that was a lot of it. I know. And this is just me being as transparent as I can. I know with like prince William, I tried with them a couple of times. I just, I got letters from him, said there are more qualified applicants. I have no military have no college. Yeah. Basically I'm a nobody, you know? Right. But my only [00:16:30] hope was okay, let, let me just get in front of somebody. Let me talk to somebody, let me explain my story.

Speaker 3: And I promise you, if you let me do that, it wants you to, you'll be inclined to give me a chance, just let me try it. And I got that chance and I sat down with, with chief battle at the time and, and, and told him, and I think he was, I think he saw it. I think he saw it. He's like, okay, all this kid needs is an opportunity to just let him run. And he gave it to me and it was, it was, you know, [00:17:00] it wasn't easy. I had to work my off. Yeah. Still do so every language, but, um, you know, and, uh, that's just what it is. I mean, I think that, uh, we tried really, really hard to push forward. I knew what the calling was and I couldn't ignore it anymore. Yeah.

Speaker 2: So, oh, so what were you, were you working in finance at the time that your first son was born?

Speaker 3: Yeah. Yep. Yep. I was working at the Rosenthal wealth management and Manassas great, great group of people. And, and man, [00:17:30] they, they just loved on me fully supportive. Uh, from the minute I started working there to the minute I decided to apply, I think they were obviously very bummed out that I was leaving. Um, but still very supportive to this day so much so that my wife networks there. Yep. She works there and, uh, and, and that's our family, you know? And, um, and so, you know, it just helps. I think that's probably the biggest thing that I've learned in my life is to [00:18:00] surround yourself with people that will support you, both in your job, in your family, in your, in your personal relationships. You know, I don't think that this transition from normal work to police work would have been nearly as easy as it was, had. I not had that support from them. Yeah. You know, and you know, cause I mean, I'm no different than any other officer that just starts, there were people in my family that were absolutely against it. I had people telling me they were praying against it, you know? And, um, that's tough to hear when you've got something that you want to do so bad. So yeah.

Speaker 2: [00:18:30] Well, I'd like to think that they was more for you and not against your

Speaker 3: Oh man. No, it was like, oh, you, I know we're praying against it because we don't want you to get shot or killed and, you know,

Speaker 2: Thanks for nothing you got shot. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3: I'm like, if it's going to happen, it's going to happen.

Speaker 2: So talking about transitioning, like how did the introduction of your first son affect your work? I mean, I guess you transitioned careers at that point. Yeah. And the one that's probably more demanding on your time and more demanding on your body. [00:19:00] Probably more, I can only imagine more stressful when you come home and tell charity, like here's what I did today. Like, how'd that talk about the introduction of your son to your life and then, you know, tie in

Speaker 3: Impacted everything else. Yeah. Yeah. So I, I'm going to take a second honestly, and give a shout out to any single parent out there because I can tell you this much, uh, I could not have done the work than I did at my last job. And even beginning [00:19:30] here as a single parent, like I look at some of the, some of the, you know, female single moms out there that are doing it day in, day out working full-time jobs. Some of them are in school with multiple kids, dads out there. Same thing. It's like, man, like I, every time I think I'm having a hard day with my two kids by myself, I'm like, okay, you got you, you are not struggling.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Especially the ones that are single because of a horrible tragedy that, [00:20:00] you know, they're dealing with the loss on top of the demands it's unbelief.

Speaker 3: Yeah. And I think that the, you know, w once I impacted once, once Judah was born, there was a, there was a change in mindset for me. It was like, okay, I'm doing this now. Not out of, not out of self-service now. Right? Yeah. His impact on my life made me feel like when, when an officer says they want to lay their lives down, or they'll be the first [00:20:30] ones to answer the call when something crazy is happening. That that is very true. But that is even more, if you are a parent, you know, it's like you start thinking about all the kids that are in there. Like we, uh, I don't, I wouldn't have a hard time. Well, let me, let me rephrase this. We worked at traffic crash today. We had a, uh, you know, uh, a vehicle get T-boned in the back of the car.

Speaker 3: There was a two year old boy properly secured in his car seat. Everything was done. The airbags [00:21:00] full deploy. I mean, this truck got, T-boned so hard. And, uh, it moved it from one lane to the other guy hit so hard. And, um, you know, as soon as I was walking up to the car, I could see through the window, there was a silhouette of a car seat in my heart just sunk, you know, and I'm just like, oh my gosh, please let this kid be okay. And, and open door. And he's totally fine. Yeah. You know, two weeks ago there was a rear end collision right out here on west Shirley where, uh, you know, a truck ended up in the back of a sedan that had to, [00:21:30] you know, three-year-olds in the bag properly secured in their car seats. I highly recommend that public service announcement, right. Use

Speaker 2: Your car suits.

Speaker 3: Oh my goodness. Go to warrant and fire, go get them to put it in. Right. And take the time to do it. Their lives are worth it. But when Judah was born, I felt even more that call to go and serve people and to protect people. Because I, I felt a connection that as a dad, you, you're holding him in your arms. It's your whole [00:22:00] world. And it's like, you want to stop everything, you know? And I, and for me, that bled over to my work. Right. And so it was like, as much as I loved working at Rosenthal doing finance, it was like, I need to get out and actually help people and go hands-on with people that are in dire emergency, and that are struggling with, I mean, you only call 9 1 1 on the, on your worst days of your life. Right. [00:22:30] Why not get in there and be that positive influence in that someone's worst day, you know what I'm saying?

Speaker 3: And I was like, if I have these feelings of protection and being in this father figure and just holding this little precious baby in my hands, if I can help another parent, you know, help their kids in those situations, you know, or help people in the city be empathetic, be sympathetic, be feel it all, you [00:23:00] know, and, and, and really get out there and, and, and try and, and do something good in the community from a police standpoint. That's what I wanted to do. Yeah. So it was like, okay, you know what? We gotta do this. Like, ah, um, ah, I've got to do this, you know? And it was scary because at the same time, it's like, okay, I don't want to get shot killed, and then have to lead this little guy too. Yeah. Yeah. But that protective nature that I think all of us as, as men and dads have, was even swelled up even more when Judah was born, that bled over my wanting to be a cop. Yeah. You guys [00:23:30] see what I'm saying? That's how that impact. It was great.

Speaker 2: I'm going to, I'm going to give another shout out to WPD. Cause when my son was about one, we thought he was having a seizure and it happened a couple of times he shook uncontrollably. And one of the, one of your guys heard on the radio that his son had had seizures before he got it was that empathetic. Like I need to be there to talk these parents through this is I've been there. And like, you don't think about that being a police officer, you think about the speeding tickets, parking tickets, car, car [00:24:00] crashes, you know, and I just, couldn't be more grateful to that person for calming us down. Ultimately you is not seizures and everything's fine. But I think it was just so important. He was at the off.

Speaker 3: Yeah, I think. And we have a young department, I think I'm one of the older guys on patrol at 32. Yeah. I think we got a lot of early twenties guys. You're like guys that don't have kids yet and that's common and I'm so happy for a lot of them, but, uh, I can tell you, man, my biggest thing that I wish I could communicate to the community is that the, yeah, we're cops, [00:24:30] we, we are held to a higher standard, but at the same time, man, we are human. Yeah. You know, we have these, we have kids, we have families, you know, and when we hear something like a traffic crash possible traveling with a child in the car, I'm telling you, I don't know any dad in our department whose heart wouldn't sink a little bit thinking about that and go, okay, we should get out there and do something and same with the fire guys. Yeah. You can see it when they get on screen the urgency to get in there and make sure everyone's okay. Is on unreal. This community has no [00:25:00] idea how, how much, how fortunate they are for the people that serve in, in, in, all, in, at the ER at, you know, at the fire company, at the police department, the Sheriff's office, you know, what sheriff Mosher is doing over there is unbelievable. Those guys are doing great and just a good time, a good time to be a part of this community. So

Speaker 2: Awesome. So, uh, you've got two kids, two boys. How old are you?

Speaker 3: Four and two Judah and Maverick. Maverick.

Speaker 2: [00:25:30] And what are the, what are they like? Are they, they like their day?

Speaker 3: I would say Judah is probably more like his mom. He's a little bit more emotional. Although I would say that probably some of my coworkers would say I'm emotional, but, uh, yeah, he's, uh, he's a little bit more emotional, a little bit more sensitive, but he is the most caring little boy. I mean, he will, he will hug you. Um, he loves running around church and, and, and talking to people and grabbing their hands and just being really excited. And he's my best friend, [00:26:00] man. I mean, I love him to death and four years old, you know, he's testing the limits, you know how it is. So it's, uh, it's, uh, it's awesome. Uh, and it almost makes you wonder, it's like, man, did I do that stuff at four years old? And I'm like, oh, I could probably get way worse. So, uh, and, and Maverick is, is to, um, terrible twos. So he is really starting to figure out how to use his words and throw temper tantrums. And, you know, he weighs almost as Jew, as much as Judah does at two, as Judah does at four. [00:26:30] So he's a tank, you know, strong. Um, and, but same, same thing. I mean, he's, he will cuddle with you. He absolutely loves his dad. He's he's a daddy's boy and Jude is more of a mama's boy. So it works out. So, uh, they're, they're great, man. And of course she wants another one. So she wants, she wants to,

Speaker 2: My might have to listen to Brian Castro's interview. Who's done a thousand plus activities.

Speaker 3: Make sure she gets on that.

Speaker 2: I talked to Jesse a [00:27:00] straight who's got seven kids that that's you imagine. Okay. I can't imagine this, you know, it's amazing, but they it's a lifestyle.

Speaker 3: I mean, he got to go get a van. Yeah. Get a, get a van, you know, you'll get a loan for take out a loan for grocery bills.

Speaker 2: Well, he's got a farm, so which, which goat or chicken do you want today. Right.

Speaker 3: But like, how do you, like, I think, I think the thing that amazed me with these families that have 5, 6, 7 kids, it's like, like I, [00:27:30] I work a ton of hours, right? Yeah. I do a lot of I'll do a lot of work with the church. And then I do a lot of special events for the police department in town. I'm not complaining. Yeah. But I know what it's like to make sure that you're giving your kids the appropriate amount of emotional input. Yeah.

Speaker 2: Yeah. How do you do that with the demands on your time? Right.

Speaker 3: And, and at, at, for two kids and I'm like, am I doing enough? And then I look at the parents that are doing the same stuff I'm doing [00:28:00] with 5, 6, 7 kids. Yeah. You know, it's superhuman, it's unreal. It's like, how are you doing, how are you finding time to sit down with each kid and, and putting in that emotional input and, and comforting them when they're hurt or encouraging them when they're learning and all that stuff. How do you do it? And it's just like unbelievable to me that you can see in the kids that they're absolutely loved that they're absolutely have those parents there. And then it's just, it's inspiring.

Speaker 2: There's been a pretty consistent [00:28:30] theme on this conversation. And, you know, I don't know if it's been apparent, but I perceived it to be that suddenly people become much more structured and much more scheduled and much more ritualistic and creating habits. Like, because your time changed so much from what was probably very nine to five ish, like to being 12 hour shifts. So, you know, off, like how do you manage to give your kids that input with that demanding schedule?

Speaker 3: Yeah, I think, uh, well, not, not to crack a joke for all my, my, [00:29:00] uh, church folks out there, but, uh, uh, I call it the, the one, the word they like the most in 20 17, 20 18 is the word intentional. So you gotta be intentional. It's like, that was their catch phrase. So he know for me, um, I think you have to make a decision that you're going to be intentional about spending time with your kids. And that's really doing it, putting the phones down, shutting the world off. Don't think about work. Don't think about anything else. Think about taking that Lego man and making him the bad [00:29:30] guy so that your son can be the good guy with his. See what I'm saying? And yeah, you've got to, you've got to be a regimented adjusting human. Okay. So like for me, um, my day starts at about four 30, every, every shift.

Speaker 3: So I get up, get up about four 30. I do a little bit of light reading, have my quiet time doing my light reading and get a little bit of food. My system pre-workout, I'm in the car, I'm at the gym. Okay. I get [00:30:00] my hour workout done by six 30. I'm at the, at the police department, clean up, get dressed, get my gear on and make sure my car is nice and tightened straight. Make sure my uniform is in nice and tight and straight and make sure I've got all the objectives that I need to get done for today. Written down voicemails, emails, everything done. Um, and then I get ready for roll call. Uh, Sergeant Moran comes in, it gives us very, very detailed stuff that we need to do. And then, so you run through the day 12 o'clock or 12 hours later, seven o'clock on [00:30:30] the dot.

Speaker 3: If you don't get held over, make sure you come home, you gotta be intentional about that time. You get home, you get home, you walk in the door, uh, and I'm not perfect at this, but this is what I strive for. Yeah. Walk in the door and it's family time, right from the get, you know, it's like you put the phones down as much as you want to get home and get caught up on Instagram and Facebook and do all that. But the phones down, but the laptop away hanging out with family, find out what's going on with the wife. How has her day going? How are the kids doing? And then, [00:31:00] you know, for me specifically get to go to bed. I jumped right into schoolwork cause I'm a full-time student. So full downstairs. So on top of all this. So, um, what are you studying? Uh, criminal psych. Okay. So a full-time student I'll spend two, you know, two hours or so doing schoolwork. Yeah. I'll try and get as much as I possibly can done there. And then I try and hit the bed by at least 10 at the very latest 10 30. Sometimes it doesn't work. Sometimes I have to push it to 11 or 12. If I'm not done with my schoolwork, [00:31:30] if something done due at midnight or whatever, and then start all over. So

Speaker 2: Have you had that ability to be regimented or like how did you start that?

Speaker 3: Oh my goodness. So yeah, I, I grew up as a kid as a completely in regard to this kind of stuff. Lazy, irresponsible, do whatever I want play video games. I'll put it off until the last second. Not until I really started reading. I'm doing a lot of reading and listened to a lot of audio books. I read a book called a total focus by [00:32:00] Brandon Webb. He's on his Navy seal, highly recommended for men and women of all ages. It will change your life. And it just talks about having that laser focus to not just what your end prize is, but also totally focusing on the small steps that will take you to the next step. And everything keeps building. The other book that I've read that really, really changed a lot of way. I do things was extreme ownership, Jocko, Willink, [00:32:30] and, and once you read that book, your life will never be the same if you, if you really read it for sure.

Speaker 3: Um, you, you start to realize that dad that, oh my goodness, I'm responsible for life. Yeah. And that is once that hits you. And it's like, it doesn't matter if they get hurt and it's not your fault. Guess what? You're still responsible for it. And you got as a man take responsibility. And that's what I try to like tell my coworkers. That's why I try to tell people at church. [00:33:00] So I tell people, friends of mine, it's like, you may not, it may not be your fault. Something happens. Right. But at the end of the day, if, if that happened under your watch, guess what? You gotta be, man, take responsibility for it. And once you realize that a lot of what you're doing is your responsibility. That weight starts to shift your priorities, which then starts to shift the little details in your life.

Speaker 3: You start to have good anxiety about little different things. [00:33:30] That ma that really matter how my son talks to someone at age nine, 10, and 11 is going to be directly affected by how much time I spend with them now at four, five and six. Right. And I know that now I wouldn't have had that thought process, you know, 3, 4, 5 years ago. So yeah, I would say those books really helped me just be intentional about, about my time and I'm not perfect. I fail at it all the time. Sometimes I oversleep. Sometimes I come home and do get on the laptop and I have to catch myself and [00:34:00] it's like, okay, but this away hanging out with the kids, you know, and, and I'm sure charity's

Speaker 2: A helpful reminder.

Speaker 3: Absolutely. She has. She she's like, come on let's, you know, and, and, you know, and I'm telling you as a, as a guy that, uh, puts in the hours that I do at, at work with the town and then, uh, being a full-time student and being at the gym super early and just doing all this, there are days where you just want to come home and sit in front of the TV and do absolutely nothing and pick up an X-Box controller and just hang out. [00:34:30] And I would say that's probably the thing too, is, is that you had to be intentional about your time for, you know, self care, you know? Um, yeah. You need to pick a time to make sure the kids are somewhere else. Make sure, you know, it's, it's just you at the house and you're just relaxing in the quiet place and just relaxing, hanging out with a dog, you know, doing nothing. Or if you get your energies from your kid and, and that helps take them with you, I'm not sure

Speaker 2: Faith [00:35:00] or being a pastor, how's that inform your, your habits or your,

Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say that, um, you know, one of my favorite verses, you know, you gotta do everything. Like you're doing it for the Lord, you know, and that, and that to me has, has carried me through my job. Cause I mean, I don't have to tell you this. There are times where someone royally, you off at work, a supervisor, or, you know, command staff member. And it's like, the last thing you want to do as a human is to do any more for that person. Sure. Right. [00:35:30] But I ingrained it in my heart and in my soul that no matter what I do, I'm going to do it as if I'm doing it for the Lord. And, and in doing that, that totally takes away everything that a senior person could, you know, do to affect your work ethic because it's not no longer about them.

Speaker 3: You want to, the human side of you wants to spite them, wants to, you know, do all that stuff. But at the end of the day, when you realize that, okay, what I'm doing is a direct reflection of my faith [00:36:00] and my faith in God and his, his love for me, um, that makes you want to try even harder, you know? And, and, and to be a good dad, same thing. It's like, how can I emulate what my heavenly father has done for me? Um, for my kids, you know, if, if they're doing something that is really, really making me mad, does, does God punish me for it? And then I would say, no, I don't see my God is a God. That is a punishing God. So for me, it's like, yeah, I want to discipline my kids, but I'm not going to show hatred towards them.

Speaker 3: [00:36:30] Yeah. You know, I'm not going to show violence towards them because that's not what God does to me. Yeah. He certainly less, he makes mistakes. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. I kind of do the same thing. So that's been it. And then also just, I got friends at church that have just been rocks to me. Yeah. You know, my pastor Ben Clark has been, has been great. And, and Noah pastors, their pastor Daniel Floyd has been, been great down to LifePoint Fredericksburg. And I go to the Colepepper canvas. Obviously my father-in-law has been a great passer, a big influence in my life over at, uh, [00:37:00] new hope. So. Yeah. I think that, uh, it just goes back to what I was saying was surrounding yourself with people that will help elevate your abilities as a, as a dad, as a father, as a worker, you do those things, everything else will fall into place.

Speaker 2: Did you find that you had to drop people that were negative influences or is there a way that you went about doing that or identifying who those,

Speaker 3: Yeah, that, that was tough. And I think at the end of the day, if you're in tune with your surroundings, [00:37:30] I think we're all deep down wise enough to know who's good for us. And who's bad for us. Yeah. You just need to separate yourself. I call it the 10,000 foot view theory. It's like, you're talking to someone, someone comes to me and ask me for advice habits all the time. They say, Hey, this is what I'm going on. But I really liked this person and blah, blah, blah. And I don't want to break up with them. And I'm like, okay, I hear what you're saying. And I can't, I can't imagine what that's like, because I've never gone through that. I would say this, take your situation. Good, [00:38:00] 10,000 feet above it yourself, and look down on it. And let's say, detach yourself. You don't know either one of these people, what would you do? Oh, I'll tell her to break up with him.

Speaker 2: It's almost,

Speaker 3: It's your F your answer.

Speaker 2: It's hard to choke that down when you're in it.

Speaker 3: Absolutely. But at the end of the day, it's like, you got to look at your situation and go, okay, these are the toxic people. And for me, it was one of them was a pastor. And that was very tough.

Speaker 2: Yeah. So you got to give people permission to separate [00:38:30] themselves from, you know, their leaders, they're mentors or people in positions to be, it's

Speaker 3: Very tough. And, um, and uh, friends, family, you know, and it's like, I'm not saying you ever have to completely cut someone out, never talk to them again, banish them away from me, send them an X. I'm not saying that because I, I believe that as humans, we have the ability to reconcile with everyone. Yeah. You know, and that being said, I do think that there are specific things that you can do as a, [00:39:00] as a person, as a man. And as a woman is to get in and, and maybe build barriers, maybe bill guardrail. I love the guard rail theory. It's like, okay, this person is still in my life, but they are in my lane right now. I'm going to merge this way and put them on the other side of the guard rail. Okay. So maybe I won't go out with them anymore, you know, on Saturday nights and do the stuff that I used to do. But how about instead, I keep talking to them via text, via Facebook, [00:39:30] and then I invite them to church, or I invite them to this community event. And I invite them to serve in the community in this way or this way. And let's see if we can change the landscape before.

Speaker 2: That's like you being intentional, not just in changing the landscape of your friendship, but trying to help them regardless of French.

Speaker 3: Right. Exactly. Cause I think, I think a lot of it is a setting, you know, it's like, you know, if you're, if you're friends with a bunch of alcoholics, then you're more susceptible to be an alcoholic. But if you get out of it, keep loving them. Yeah. But you have to be intentional about your, [00:40:00] your actions around those types of people.

Speaker 2: That'd be interesting is when our kids are like 7, 8, 9 years old and they hang out with the great other 7, 8, 9 year olds, but their parents are idiots and we got to hang out with,

Speaker 3: It's kinda just like, I know it's gonna it's it's like you almost wonder because like, we're, we're, we're at that point now where it's like, we're thinking about putting Judah in school now. And it's like, okay, where are we going to put him? And it's like, man, what are some of these parents teaching their kids? Is this going to rub off on [00:40:30] my kid? But at the end of the day, I think that if you're rooted in your non-negotiables, you know, for me, a non-negotiable for me is, is to, you know, treat everyone with kindness and to genuinely work as hard as possible with whatever you're doing. Yeah. That's a non-negotiable for me. And I think if you instill those non-negotiables, if you decide what they are and then instill those principles into your children, that'll build a bubble of protection around them. I believe that [00:41:00] I believe that. And I've seen it. My father-in-law did that with all three. His children, charity hope. Faith. Yes, sir. That's the other names. Hope, hope, faith, and love. He did it with them. Yeah. You ever realize that she has three

Speaker 2: Kids, three girls? Yeah.

Speaker 3: Charity is the oldest charity and love obviously go hand in hand wording. The middle child is hope. Yeah. Obviously the favorite and then a faith is the youngest ones of faith. Hope and love charity. So, um, [00:41:30] Yeah. So, um, so, and he did that, uh, you know, pastor Barry did that. I think he instilled those principles in his kids. Charity went to a party school at JMU. I think it protected her. Yeah. You know, I know what I know of hope. I think she was unwavering in a lot of

Speaker 2: Things that she went through in her life and faith too. I think she was exposed to a lot of things in her life that the world had AF public school, stuff like that. And I don't think she wavered from it because she had good parents that instilled those principles. And I can only hope [00:42:00] to do the same thing. The bubble is basically a reflection of the example that the parents.

Speaker 3: Yeah. Okay. Absolutely. Okay. For, for perfect example. Um, one of my best friends, uh, well, my brother-in-law Jeremy stags, so that he's got two great parents ran Randy and Amy. They, they really instilled in Jeremy at a young age to be kind and, and, and do that. There's a story I love about Jeremy, where he had the reputation as a kid of going and finding the kid that was sitting by himself and sitting with him at lunch. [00:42:30] And it's just like, you look at that and you're like, darn it. Those parents did a good job and I can only hope to do that. That's what I want. You know, it's like my kid right now, Judah, I love it because he goes around, he grabs hands, walks people around at church, gives them hugs. And I'm like, okay, I think we're on the right track.

Speaker 3: You know, it's, it's a work every single day. You can't let up. Right. And you gotta pray a lot. And, and you got to have that faith that, you know, God's going to protect them and, and, and you gotta be patient with them. They're going to go through stuff. I feel so bad for some of the stuff [00:43:00] that I put my parents through. Oh my goodness. I was not a good kid. So, uh, you know, but you know, it's, uh, I think you just got to make sure that you got to decide what your non-negotiables are, what your principles are as a family. Once you've done that, instill those principles into your kids, work hard for me, you know, it's, for me, it's work hard, love people, you know, walking integrity and, and I've really believed that's carried us. So it hasn't been perfect. No, but that's what we strive for. [00:43:30] Aim small, Ms. Small, a specific target will get you a specific result. We're just going to do that.

Speaker 2: I love that. Told a couple of people recently, uh, you know, if you don't know what your goal is, find out what it is clarified, and it'll be easier to accomplish it. Otherwise you're just running around aimless.

Speaker 3: I love, uh, I love 'em. I can't remember exactly what book I was reading, but they were talking about goals, set it and forget it. So if your, if your end goal is a set, your goal, know what the direction is. Have that ingrained [00:44:00] in your mind, meditate on it, fall in love with it, then forget about it. Okay. Once you know what your goal is, then focus on your now

Speaker 2: Detach from the result,

Speaker 3: Detach from the result. Think about, okay, because then what's going to happen is you will have that in the back of your mind. Right? Okay. So this next opportunity, is this going to serve my goal or not? If it's not move on, is this going to serve my goal or not? Is this ultimately going to be there or not? You know, same thing with your kids. You know, I want my kids to be, [00:44:30] um, like what charity, her sisters are. Everyone knows them as loving giving, just absolutely magnetic personalities. Right. I want my kids to be that way. So is isolating them putting in front of a TV all day, not letting the hanging out with other kids. Is that going to serve them? No. So you know what, on my days off, instead of going at four o'clock, I'm going to take them to the gym with me. Yeah. They open up, you know, they open up at nine, 10, I'm going to get in there. They want to put them in, in daycare, in the [00:45:00] kid's care area with all the other kids play with them, expose them to other kids and have fun and then take them back out. You know, that that's being intentional that serves our angle. Yeah. You know, same with church getting there early, putting them with other church kids that have, you know, like principals.

Speaker 2: Yeah. I like to reverse engineer things. Like what do I want people to say when I'm dead? You know, like, what do I want to, yeah. It's nobody on their death bed wishes it. Somebody [00:45:30] thought they were more of a jury or wish they worked more, spent less time with their family. So first engineering, Hey, this is Tyler Ross here. Thanks for taking the time to listen to part one of our interview with Chris Campbell. The next question I asked him in part two is about the gunshot wound. He sustained during a training exercise, uh, as a police officer, as well as getting into a lot of the short answer questions that you may become [00:46:00] accustomed to by now, if you've been listening to the podcast. So thanks for taking the time to listen to part one. I hope you enjoy a part two, just as much as I did. I learned so much from Chris in both halves of our conversation. So thank you again and, uh, check out part two.


Speaker 2: Have a very particular set of

Speaker 1: Skills. I'm going to have fun and you're going to have fun.

Speaker 2: [00:00:30] Hey, Tyler, Ross here. Thanks for taking the time to click in and listen to Chris Campbell. Part two, we had such a great long conversation that we had to cut it into two parts. I hope you enjoyed the first part. If you haven't heard it, definitely check it out. The second half of the interview is great. I learned so much from Chris and I hope you guys do as well. So without further ado, please enjoy part two. Chris Campbell. I want to get into one more story from you, and then I want to get into some short answers, but [00:01:00] I'd love for people to hear the story about how you were injured on the job. It's not everyday that people get to hear a description of what it's like to be shot. Yeah,

Speaker 3: Well, which time I actually got hurt twice, a lot of people don't know about the first one. So, um, it was, it was, it was, it was a, it I've gone through something at first times in here. And that only played into the more of the, of the doubt that I had about my dream. But you just can't give up. You can't. So, you know, the first time I got hurt, I was, uh, I think nine, [00:01:30] 10 weeks into an 18 week academy. So I was over halfway done. Right. And, um, and if you know anything about going through the academy, the first few weeks are the first, like six, seven weeks are all classroom, your PowerPoint, PowerPoint, constitutional law search and seizure, criminal investigations, basic, all that stuff in a very monotonous it's so boring. And, um, we finally get to the fun stuff.

Speaker 3: And then it was like day two. Someone tackled me, blindsided me, and [00:02:00] felt a pop in my shoulder arm went numb, went to the hospital, did an MRI. They said, okay, you blew your labor about, wow. So surgery a couple of weeks later, did he get to move? My arm for a few months was able to make it back to the academy, finished up strong as a class leader doing that. Uh, so that was great. Hit the road. Everything was, was clicking. I mean, things are going great as helping out with all the community stuff. Then June 13th, we were at a facility, a federal facility. [00:02:30] I don't know that I can say the name of it. I won't say it. Um, but we had federal, federal facility doing, uh, doing some training with, uh, our patrol rifles, the Colt M four, which most people know as an AR 15 style, you know, uh, a rifle, um, very powerful weapon.

Speaker 3: And we were doing some close quarters stuff. And without going into too much detail, uh, around from another officer hit a pole that was on the range. And it came back in, uh, towards, and, um, [00:03:00] to by left was officer Eggers who took some metal fragments to the face. Wow. You know, and then, uh, I remember in that moment, I'm, I'm sitting there and I'm staring down the, you know, the scope of my gun and I'm looking down and I'm about to fire. And then I felt like someone just hit me in the chest with a sledge hammer. Really. I mean, it was just blunt force or blunt force. Not what I would have imagined. Yeah. You think you're getting shot. If [00:03:30] you take, you give, getting shot, you think it's gonna burn short, sharp, uh, hot, you know, a stinging maybe, or like, not notice until 30 seconds after you ran blunt trauma.

Speaker 3: And it felt like something hit my entire left side with like a sledgehammer and this was a fragment. Um, so yeah. So basically what happened was it missed my vest? Yeah. I was wearing, I was wearing a Bulletproof vest. It missed my vest, went into the armpit arm, opening area and hit me right in the rip. [00:04:00] I didn't feel, you know, it's like at first you were just kind of confused. I was like, what the heck was that? Um, and I look over at Eggers and he's got blood running down his face. And so we all kind of like started to tend to him. It's like what what's going on? And then I'm like, man, I just feel uncomfortable. So I put my thumbs in my vest, like all cops do for a second and adjust it. And then I pulled my thumb out and my left thumb.

Speaker 3: I look at it and my heart, my arm is just dredged in blood. Yeah. And at that point I tried to take a [00:04:30] breath and realize that like, oh my goodness, my left lung isn't inflating is what it felt like. Yeah. I could tell. I was like, it feels like it's crushing. Something is crushing my long right now. And I didn't know what was happening. And so I started to, uh, you know, a way for everyone open my vest, go to take it off and all the officers on scene, you could just see it in their eyes. They're just like, oh no. Cause I was wearing a white t-shirt and it was blood soaked from basically [00:05:00] the top of my pectoral muscle all the way down to my lower left oblique, just blood just pouring. So I started to go in shock almost immediately after seeing it, after seeing it, I looked down and then it's just like, I start to realize, man, I remember my training coordinator saying, stay, remain calm.

Speaker 3: You've been shot. And then Eggers, thank God for him. I mean, he was there. He, he was a former, uh, medic. And so, you know, he, he looked me in the eyes like I got you, we're gonna, you, we're going to take care of this. Just, you know ha um, yeah, [00:05:30] breathe, control your breathing, you know, see. So they walked me over your staging area. They get my shirt off, they take compressions, they put it on the, on, on my chest and they, how big is this mood? I tell you, I didn't even want to look at it at the time. I don't think it was any more than maybe the half size of a dime. It wasn't, it wasn't very big. It went in, didn't go out. And they were, and that was the thing. It was like, everything started to bruise almost immediately.

Speaker 3: It was all black and blue. And then of course it was just blood, blood, blood, blood. [00:06:00] So they, they patched that. Remember, I, I'm not breathing. Like, it doesn't feel like I'm breathing normally and I'm going into shock. Yeah. Um, you know, so they've rolled me over, they're looking for an exit wound. They're like, okay, we don't see an exit wound. And I just remember, I remember saying I'm like, is that thing in me is like, is that, is this really happening? Like, is this in me? Like, stay calm, trying to keep me calm. And basically what happened was that, uh, the round itself ricocheted off and came back and then I took the round into the [00:06:30] side of the chest. So they, they, you know, said they radio for EMS. EMS showed up out, man, I think it was like six minutes. It was fast.

Speaker 3: Are you remembering this? Remembering this? Yeah. Yup. Yup. So I remember all this and then, uh, they get there, they checked me out. The first EMS tech. I remember he walked up, he looked he's like, okay, let me take a look at it. He's like lift your arm up. And so, and then he pulls vantage away and he close it back up and puts it. And then he gets on the radio. And I remember you saying star [00:07:00] air care now. Yeah. And when I heard that, I was like, oh no, I'm in trouble. Like, I'm like, this is, this is bad fear, carers, helicopter, helicopter, like get, get the chopper roll in. Like it's, let's go. So then they started to put me on a back board, strapped me down. I was told later that they hit me with a, uh, like a fentanyl drip, I guess, to help with the pain. Okay. And from that point, the point basically when they put me on the back board to the arriving in Fairfax, [00:07:30] uh, or unit there, um, I was in and out of consciousness. Yeah. Maybe four or five times, like

Speaker 2: Memories of opening your eyes and being in a helicopter.

Speaker 3: Right. And that, and I think that was probably more damaging the actual round itself. And I'll tell you why I was, I remember being in the chopper and the first time I lost consciousness, what, what really made it hard was obviously was I couldn't breathe. I was in [00:08:00] a ton of pain. I didn't, there was uncertainty of all we knew is that there was a bullet in me and I couldn't breathe. Right. And I felt like I was losing consciousness. And so for me, you automatically think worst case scenario and it's just like, okay, I'm dying. Like I'm dying and I'm losing consciousness. Um, this is it.

Speaker 2: I lose consciousness.

Speaker 3: And well, the first time I didn't know that I was going to wake up. I thought that was why I was like, oh my God. So this is actually [00:08:30] happening. So you start thinking about things that you don't normally think about. Like I thought about my childhood and then I started thinking about, okay, my life insurance policies in place. Okay. My beneficiaries are in place for all of my accounts. Okay. Um, my, I know that the, the police department has all my paperwork for me, for all of my, uh, you know, if I pass away, this is how things are going to be done. This is who I want to do, what they've got all that. So I'm like, okay, so you start running this checklist in your mind that you never think you to go [00:09:00] through, but all of us officers probably do go through it and I'm sitting there thinking about it.

Speaker 3: And then I lost consciousness. And then like, uh, I remember waking up again and like, like still being in pain and screaming in the helicopter. And, and then, uh, and then it was just like, so this repeated itself four or five times, you know, at the end of the day we get to the, or they, they find out what happened in there. They used to like, okay, you're going to be okay. They leave the round in my chest. It's still in there to this day, everything healed up and I'm, and I'm good. I stayed a couple of days at Fairfax, went through a bunch of rehab, [00:09:30] uh, took about five months off for, I guess, four months off from, you know, working in the police department, uh, and then got right back into it and things were going great. I will tell you the reason why that, that was probably more damaging than the actual round itself.

Speaker 3: And this is why I'm such a big believer in counseling, mental health and taking care of your mental health. Um, I'm a, I'm a crisis intervention instructor with the police department. I take mental health very seriously. I go to counselors, myself. I have my own mentors that I work with regularly, [00:10:00] mental health. It's such, it's such an important thing. I went to counseling. I went and saw a psychotherapist after all that, to help with PTSD, to help with, you know, just, uh, anxiety. There were things that like I could, if I heard a helicopter, we'll be right back in that sinking feeling that I was dying. Wow. Uh, if I, you know, I drive by Clark brothers every day on the way home because I live in Bealeton and, uh, you know, it's right there. I would say, I remember sitting in traffic in front of Clark bros and hearing gunshots.

Speaker 3: And you're just [00:10:30] like, you know, you hear it. And just like, you shake a little bit, you know, after this is happening. And it's like, that was such a tough thing to overcome because you still want to continue to love your family and to be there and be that strong person for them. But you're not as a dad. I think we feel like we can't be vulnerable and we can't let people help us. And that was probably the biggest thing that I learned through my therapy sessions was that it is okay as a man, as a father, [00:11:00] as the head of the household to realize that you can't do it all, you know, and that you need to lean on your wife and that you need to lean on your friends and that you need to lean on those that love you and care for you.

Speaker 3: And so I did that and it took me months to figure it out. But, you know, I did that. I leaned on the guys at PE, they would come over and hang out with me and I eventually got over it. And, uh, and, and I've been to the, I've been to that exact range, you know, since, um, it was a little bit weird at first being there, but [00:11:30] got through it shot really, really well. Um, the time I was up for other, for our last call and, uh, and, and I can't say enough about, uh, the job that, uh, you know, Lieutenant Carter acting chief police has been doing with me, um, and same with Lieutenant camera and, uh, and Lieutenant Mellon. They, they really took care of me throughout that whole ordeal. Um, Sergeant Moran, same thing. So I'm very thankful, man. It was, it was a terrible, a terrible thing, but man, I've been able to use it to touch [00:12:00] other people and to reach out and to talk about, to further the importance of mental health and counseling, because I use that I'm on scene and I'll, and, and people will be like, well, I don't want to do counseling.

Speaker 3: I see that as you know, they see it as weird or, you know, I don't, I just never want to open it up. I'm like, dude, look at me, I'm a cop that likes to lift weight and likes to, you know, likes to talk back. And, and I, I'm a type a personality. I got tats, dude, I'm telling you the best [00:12:30] thing that I ever did was to get vulnerable and to allow people, to, to counsel you and to seek mental health. And I'm telling you, you do that. It will only allow you to be a better dad and only without all you to be a better husband. And it's not perfect. I still struggle with it every day, but it's been the best thing ever.

Speaker 2: I think that that going through that experience created like, were you vulnerable prior to that experience?

Speaker 3: Yeah, but probably not, not [00:13:00] the, not the level that I am now. I'm certainly more empathetic now coming back from, from what, how I handled scenes back before that was maybe more stern and don't get me wrong. I mean, if someone wants to get certain with me, I know how to give it right back. And I'm not afraid to do that. Yeah. But you know, now it's like, I think I recognize a little bit quickly quicker now when someone's maybe struggling from an emotional component, it's helped me [00:13:30] really bridge that gap. It's really helped me figure out how to effectively communicate with those people. And, and, uh, and that's been great. You know, if we have a suicidal subject, I love being the guy to get in there and sit down and talk to them and figure it out and get them to go to the hospital and Hey, look, I'm going to be here right with you. I'll take you myself. All that. I love it. Yeah. That's my thing. Um, and I think going through that whole situation, it's only furthered my, want to be that kind of officer to be that kind of dad to be that kind of husband and be that kind of friend. So I've [00:14:00] been working out really good. I just hope one day I get the biggest strong, like you

Speaker 2: Do,

Speaker 3: Like how many, uh, you did, what 3000 pull-ups in a minute or something

Speaker 2: Like that, something like that.

Speaker 3: That was amazing.

Speaker 2: Oh, thanks, man. That was a lot of fun. We've raised some good money. It was a 353 in an hour. It was fun. It was more than anybody guests. That's more than, I guess when you got a little [00:14:30] audience and thinking about everyone that you do represents, you know, it was 24 50, I think, per pull up. If I do one more, that's 25 more bucks going to the boys and girls club. So it was a lot of fun. Not as bad as he would've. Yeah. I had a hard time with my grip for 24

Speaker 3: Hours, but must be pretty good. Yeah, it

Speaker 2: Was all right, man. It was great. But no, thanks

Speaker 3: For sharing that story. Yeah. No, a lot of people ask about it and how it happened and you know, I don't blame anyone. It's just a freak accident, [00:15:00] you know? And, uh, you know, you can go to a range a hundred times and that's not going to happen. I don't, but you know, even still nothing's perfect. We, as a, as a department, uh, adjusted some of the way we did things that made it even more safe than it was before, because we were very safe before. Sure. You got to

Speaker 2: Adjust. Yeah.

Speaker 3: Move the pole. I mean, and that's the thing. I mean, we, we made some adjustments there and things have been really great. I don't think anyone's nervous about, uh, at least I'm not, I'm not nervous about going, I'd go back to the range with those guys [00:15:30] any day of the week. Now I trust everyone over there. So

Speaker 2: I think a neared I'm going to call it a near death experience. So I think anyone that has an experience like that, there probably aren't a ton of people that are as close as you. So it has that like introduce more people in your life that like you like, wow, that's your experience. Here's what, here's what mine was there. You find a lot of near death experience.

Speaker 3: Yeah. It seems to, you seem to get, be a magnet for it anymore,

Speaker 2: Um, that you all share. [00:16:00] Like, is there a, you know, something that's consistent across everybody's expense,

Speaker 3: Everyone, every single person that I've taught and some have been cops, you know, we, uh, the Capitol police foundation, I've been able to talk to some of those guys up there. They helped us out financially while we were out, obviously, as you know, uh, worker's comp doesn't pay, you know, what you normally make. So it was tough there for a few months, but they helped out a lot. I got to talk to some of those guys and all other officers, there's a, there's a Sheriff's deputy down spots. They got shot several times. And I think the most consistent thing is that [00:16:30] we just try to enjoy life more now. Yeah. You know what I mean? I don't think it's too, even too different than those that have attempted suicide and realize that this isn't actually what they want. They, there's a story of a guy that jumped off a bridge, uh, the golden gate bridge.

Speaker 3: And as soon as he left the handrail, he wished he could have had it back and he survived the fall, barely survived it. And, and, and his whole story now is he just enjoys life more. You're more intentional about enjoying your life. And, and for me, it's the same thing. [00:17:00] It's like, I go out every day when I think I want to complain about something perspective. Right. And so it's like, everything like that keeps someone that's been through near death experience that has made the choice to enjoy life. It keeps us humble. Yeah. I think at times when, like I said earlier, when I want to complain, when, when, you know, when the kids are driving me crazy, when, when work isn't going the way that I'm hoping it would, you know, it's like, I can't sit here and complain about this because I, [00:17:30] you know, I could be dead.

Speaker 3: Yeah. Or like four years, five years ago, I would've given anything to be the parking officer's assistant. You know what I mean? It's like, that's how bad I wanted to work in law enforcement. And then I look at where I'm at now, like seriously, like I look at where I'm at now. I'm like, oh my gosh, like, nevermind wildest dreams. Would I ever thought that the chief of police would send me out to [00:18:00] speak to a group of kids about integrity or, you know, the chief of police would send me out to a group of kids to read or, you know, um, this organization would invite me to come do this. And, and it's like daily.

Speaker 2: I, I believe it. I mean, I feel like they've branded you as like the face of the department almost. And I think you're the perfect person.

Speaker 3: And that's so humbling because I'm like a, it just coming from where I was and knowing, you know, what I went through. And then, you know, [00:18:30] prior to being a cop, it doesn't just happen overnight. It was years and years and years, and years and resilience and staying focused on, on what the angle is. And, and now we're there. And then now I'm even thinking of, of different, you know, even higher ex you know, things set goals. And it's just like unbelievable to even think that you're here. So,

Speaker 2: Yeah, the, uh, the idea of the near death experience, I've, uh, I think it was Wayne Dyer that said that you should strive to die while you're alive. And so [00:19:00] do you think, like the idea of that having that experience has changed, you made you more empathetic, made you appreciate life and enjoy it? Like, do you know anyone that's successfully manufactured that feeling?

Speaker 3: I don't personally, I don't know anyone that's really been able to

Speaker 2: Drive to. I don't know how,

Speaker 3: Yeah. I, you know, I don't know anyone that's been able to successfully manufacture it, but, uh, you know, I do think that there are people out there that, uh, are able to walk with that same humble attitude, [00:19:30] knowing that life is just a breath. Yeah. You know, I think, I think you could experience that same thing. If you've, if you've got someone that's been very close to, you have other father figure or, you know, brother, sister, brother, that absolutely loved life, you know, and then they're not there. So it's like, you want to honor that person by loving your life as much as humanly possible. I think it's the same thing. Yeah. You know, I, I, you know, obviously there are some differences, but I think that that's probably about the closest that I've seen to it, you know? Um, more, one big [00:20:00] inspiration for me. And I don't mind giving her shout out is, uh, Becky howdy over at Chick-fil-A, you know, she's been, uh, she's been there.

Speaker 2: I've known her for ages, just from being

Speaker 3: Around electric personality, the nicest, well, her mom just passed away, uh, after a long battle with cancer. And that was her, her best friend. And, uh, I'm telling you, you see Becky now, she's still smiling, still loving it. I don't know that she gets home and, you know, gets behind closed doors and probably cries her eyes out. And it's just [00:20:30] like, she still gets out there still gets it done and still, and that's expired. It's like, you know, she's like she is living her life because I know that, you know, I know that that's what her mom would've wanted her to do. They were best friends. Her mom smiles every time I saw pictures of her mom, just same thing. And this is like, so I think that's the relationship that the benefit of having that knowledge and relationship with death is knowing that life is so special. And you just really got to get

Speaker 2: After. It really [00:21:00] creates some perspective for the

Speaker 3: Labs. Yeah, absolutely. You know, I, I, one of the biggest things that I'm afraid of is we got a, we got a puppy when we first got married in 2013. So, uh, Winston, our golden, uh, our, our yellow lab was a year and a half, two years old when Judah was born, they're going to grow up together. That's cool. And Winston will likely pass away when Judah is 12, 13, that's going to be so hard. And I'm just like, [00:21:30] man, you just think about just different ways. Death is going to affect someone. And I know it's going to hurt him when it comes, but let's enjoy it now while we got it. And just really true

Speaker 2: This intersection at Waterloo and Shirley, when I was six years old, I was sitting in the passenger seat when my parents told me that our golden retriever died. I remember it specifically. And I think we have a dog also that growing up with our kids and that's going to be more than likely their first experience with [00:22:00] death and loss. Yeah. It'd be interesting to see how we handle those things. Imagine as a pastor, you've handled many things like that, many people, many different,

Speaker 3: Um, you know, I'm thankful that I haven't had to do it as much as like my father-in-law or, you know, charities, granddad. He's done hundreds of funerals, I can't imagine. And buried friends of charity and yeah. And students of his. And I can't imagine that, but, but at the same time, it's like, I know how I know how precious life is. And, [00:22:30] and, um, going through this thing, you know, taking this round of the chest is only reinforced and push me to cherish it all the more. Yeah. So

Speaker 2: That's awesome. Let's do so many short answers. So I just have a series of questions and, you know, I'd like to like to hear what you think, and we may, we may tangent a little bit, but the first one is what is on your list of things to never do as a dad what's on your not to do list.

Speaker 3: Oh, my goodness. My not to do list is, is to really lose my temper. [00:23:00] That's very hard to do. Oh, yes. Yeah. Uh, I think if you've ever had a four and a two year old by yourself and it's just, you know, no one else is around. I mean there and you do. I, I spanked my children, you know, I don't hit them, but I certainly, they get their Spanx. I did too. I can tell you that. There were times when I was a, you know, in, in, in high school and early twenties where I lost completely lost my temper and it was totally unreasonable. And I think that, that one thing that I'd never want to have happen is, is my kids to see [00:23:30] that side of me, you know? And, uh, I think I've done a pretty good job at that. So far, hopefully

Speaker 2: Something that keeps you from losing your temporary or like,

Speaker 3: Yeah. Uh, so anytime they, they get mad, like seriously, I, the one thing I do is I grit my teeth. I take a deep breath and then I just have to think about what wa what has should I handle this of charity was standing right next to me, the wife, you know, it's like, okay.

Speaker 2: Perspective. It's probably a pretty good.

Speaker 3: [00:24:00] All right, let's take a step forward. Okay, honey, I need you to stop hitting your brother in the face with this thing that I've told you to not do a hundred times. Okay. Okay, good. Yeah. Go to your room, close the door, you know? And so I can relate to that. Absolutely. It's tough. It's certainly tough because we're

Speaker 2: Human. How long do you let them? How long you let them fight for not

Speaker 3: Very long. Of

Speaker 2: Course. Yeah. Same size, [00:24:30] but too big

Speaker 3: Difference. Not very long. Probably not nearly as a long as my, my, uh, shoot, man. I'm, uh, I've knocked my brother unconscious. Yeah.

Speaker 2: You guys probably roughing talking, you guys are all

Speaker 3: Pretty close. So yeah. Uh, we may have my brother Anthony we're two years apart, you know, and at 16 and 14, dude, we just hammered on each other and our other brother was probably not 10 at the time. So I mean, maybe he's right there behind us. So, and then we also, you know, we grew up racing motor, so we weren't, we weren't afraid to get hurt, you know? So [00:25:00] I knocked my brother and Cod just once with the styrofoam airplane, you know, body slammed off of the trampoline, you know, holes and drought, all that stuff, you know, standard brother, uh, standard brother material.

Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm trying to figure out how long to let them go for, I usually go until one of them starts to look like they're about to cry or till one a little bit. Yeah. So what, what is your greatest hope for your,

Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely. My greatest hope for my kids is that, uh, [00:25:30] they live lives and have the reputation of loving others. Yeah. You know, that's, that's my greatest hope for them because I think that's how you, I think there's this big misconception about legacy, you know, I, for the longest time, I was a big believer in, and I think that maybe this is because of the sales background that I had, that your legacy is that you were a successful person. You had the job, you had the money, you were able to go on these lavish vacations [00:26:00] at body's nice homes and do all this stuff. And I think that that does have a, a certain, uh, you know, appeal to it. Even now, you want to be responsible with your, with your finances and stuff like that. But at the end of the day, I think my greatest hope for my kids is that they create a legacy of love and hope and empowerment within their families as well, because that'll be a direct reflection of how charity not raised them. Yeah. I think that, uh, the biggest principle that I've learned is that [00:26:30] you get your fulfillment by putting others before you, you know, you, for me, I used to go out and, and I would buy motorcycles and, and buy all this stuff and go and get food and, and, and hang out with my friends. And it was all very self-serving. But once I started to flip that script a little bit and really focus on others, that's when I started to really feel the life. Come on.

Speaker 2: Did that, like when did you transition from

Speaker 3: You to them? Probably [00:27:00] right around the time I met charity. I mean, it, it was, it was, it was at an and right when I got surrounded by her, her family. Cause they're very much like that her family is, is, is a very giving family, you know, uh, I do shameless plug Dave Ramsey solutions. If you, if you're, if you're a money, nut, like I love being responsible with money. Dave Ramsey talks about being responsible for your money, financial peace university. It's a great thing. You'll learn that, uh, you'll feel more fulfilled. The more [00:27:30] you give to other people, unless you give to yourself that fulfilling it's, it's an odd concept. But when you decide to stop loving yourself so much and start loving others, things like the hardships that you used to dwell on and go through and just beat yourself up on that stuff, won't matter as much anymore.

Speaker 3: Yeah. You'll start loving other people. And then you'll see that that is where you get your fulfillment from. That is where you're going to get your, your hope and your joy from is helping [00:28:00] other people. Um, you know, and that has really played a pivotal role in my, in the reason why I do what I do with the town and with the police department, I work a ton of hours. I mean, it's unbelievable how many hours I work because I, I not only just do patrol, which is a full-time gig with overtime, but I also do a lot of community outreach at handle or social media pages. And, and I do a, you know, anytime that the department needs me to, oh, I also go down to the, uh, [00:28:30] academies and I teach down there new recruits. I do all that. But I'm telling you that is all other people focused.

Speaker 3: Right. I have my times where it's even a charity and I have to recharge each other's batteries. I get that. But the main thing is that my standard is to go out and love other people pour into other people because when you see them rise, I'm telling you, it makes you rise too. Yeah. So that's my that's, that's my greatest hope for my kids is that they learn that principle early, that they, they love people. They pour into people and then they [00:29:00] elevate everyone around them. That's kind of like, I've tried to do so. That's awesome.

Speaker 2: So how do you, how do you teach your kids to be

Speaker 3: Resilient? So it's tough because I've got one kid that's really, really emotional in, in Judah. Yeah. And then I've got one kid that just doesn't seem to care, but with Judah, you know, I think that a, an emotional resilience, I think, cause he is very emotional, you know, he's very in touch with his emotions. And I think, um, the thing that I've found that [00:29:30] really helps me with, with showing him how to be resilient and things, when his feelings are hurt or even physically, you know, it's like, is you gotta, you gotta remember at that age, they're there parts of their brains aren't even engaging. Right. Right. So they're screaming and cry their minds out. And you're trying to reason they don't even hear you, man. They're like, so you're getting frustrated because this crying child, isn't getting what you're saying, but it's like, they, they don't, they can't even compete what's happening.

Speaker 3: Cause their brains are developed [00:30:00] in the frontal lobe area. Right. Yeah. I don't know if that's the frontal lobe is crap, but it's what I'm saying. So I think the main thing is, is, is to make sure I continue to just get intimate with him on an emotional level. Um, and to let him know that I see it and I recognize what he's going through and that, Hey man, like, Hey buddy, like I understand that, you know, this happened. Or even whenever, like I yell at him, he gets emotional. And when he gets in trouble and you know, perfect example when I spank him. [00:30:30] Yeah. I don't just spank him Chaplin. Wally Smith at, uh, the police department taught us, taught us this principle. You know, it's like, if you, if your kid has done something bad and you need to smack her and you need to make that the most intimate thing that happens between you and it's like, I was like, why are you talking to him?

Speaker 3: He's like, so what you do is you take your kid into, into his room, you sit him down and you put your arm around and you tell him, you love him. And you say, Hey, look, you're going to get a spanking. And the reason you're going to get the spanking is because you did this, do you understand why that that's not, you, you can't just [00:31:00] SWAT at your brother. You can't SWAT at your mom. You can't say that to your mom. And then it's like, you know, I love you. You know? So, but yeah, we'll go ahead and turn around and then turn around. And then he's screaming. No, don't do it that you spank him. And it hurts him. And he starts crying. And it's in that moment that it's really intimate where you just pick them up and you hold him now and you say, look, this had to happen because you did this.

Speaker 3: This is a consequence of your action, but know that I will always love you [00:31:30] and you just hold him. And then he will sit there and he will cry in your arms and he will snuggle you and hug you. He won't hate you for it. Yeah. Cause I think that's, uh, that's the biggest thing is like, you want to discipline your kids, but you don't want to do it to a point where they hate you for it or they despise you or they don't want you to be around, you know what I'm saying? So it's like, you almost want to do it and then they want to be comforted by you too, you know? And, and that's been huge for us. So, um, and I think it's helped him be more resilient as a, as a little boy. And uh, and it's helped [00:32:00] us as parents, um, really know that what we're doing in our discipline is, is intimate and intentional and that he's getting it, you know?

Speaker 3: So that's been a big thing for us. Right on. What do you think is the role of a father? Yeah, I think the role of father is, is, uh, is obviously probably the most important. I can't remember who said it, but it was like the best, the best way you can be a role model for your kids is to love your wife. Yeah. Right. I don't exactly remember where that came from. I'm sure people [00:32:30] listening are like, oh, that's, you know, that's whatever it is. But, uh, yeah, I think the most important, uh, thing to do for your kids is to be a role model that they want to come to and they need help. You know what I'm saying? I love that there was a, uh, there was, uh, a quote I saw the other day. It's like, you want to be the kind of dad where instead of your kids saying, when he's in trouble.

Speaker 3: Oh crap. You know, uh, I gotta call my dad to, oh man, I need to call dad. Yeah. You know, [00:33:00] the difference in tone. It's like, you it's like, you don't want to do it. It's like, you have to let your dad know something bad happened. And then it's like, you wanna let your dad know because something bad happened. You know what I'm saying? I want to be bad. Yeah. That's exactly what I don't want to be from my kids. And it's tough. I think that's the biggest thing is, is that's the biggest, uh, role to for me is to be the man and the person that my kids can always come to [00:33:30] and do it without shame without, uh, you know, anger, you know, and, and to be that it's tough. Yeah. That's that I can't tell you how hard that is because I'm an emotional person that gets angry, you know, and I have to control that, but that, that's what I want to be for them.

Speaker 2: So I, on a little lighter note, who's, who's your favorite television dad?

Speaker 3: Oh, Frank Reagan. What

Speaker 2: Shows that?

Speaker 3: I [00:34:00] haven't seen it. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Greatest TV show ever. I mean, it is a, if you, like, I mean, if you like cop shows, I, you know, some of us cops don't want to have anything to do with cop shows. I love this show. It's about, uh, the New York city, uh, in YPD commissioner, his whole family's involved. He's got a kid that is in the lower ranks. He's got a kid that's in a detective, uh, unit. His daughter is the district attorney. So, you know, it's like the whole family's involved in law enforcement. Right. But it's [00:34:30] very family oriented, the TV show. So they always close the TV show out with them having Sunday lunch together. And, and absolutely so, but that, that's my favorite TV dad. I'm trying to think of what his name is. Tom Selleck. Oh, top selling, obviously mustache only, ever wish I could grow.

Speaker 3: It would take me 25 years to do that. And I still would. I still wouldn't be a man. You know what I'm saying? So, uh, yeah, so Tom Selleck and he carries himself with [00:35:00] such dignity and purpose and presence and just, he's a huge dude that you could just, you know, you just want to hug him and, you know, he loves his children will do anything for them, allows them to make the mistakes, allows them to, you know, learn from them as well. Yeah. So I would say hands down, that'd be, that'd be my guy right there

Speaker 2: For sure. Oh, you had to say it was Tom, so Yeah. All right. So if you were writing [00:35:30] a book about your life now as a parent, what were some of the, maybe the name of the chapter that you're in now? Or a couple of chapters that you've

Speaker 3: Experienced? Yeah. If I were to write a book now I think the title would certainly be love others. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I've thought about that, that so many times over the last couple of years, it's just like, I really don't think I've been able to Excel as a person financially, even, um, in my work until I decided to stop focusing on myself and start, [00:36:00] I'm not saying to ignore myself. Yeah. You're constantly family. My family is the most important thing to me. Hands down. Yeah. I listened to audio books and read books for self improvement. Right. But when I really started to realize that life is there's more to life than just making everything about me and my family. And instead realize that, Hey, live your life, loving others and giving to [00:36:30] others, it's going to, it's going to change everything. It will change everything, man.

Speaker 3: I would say that, uh, if I was, if I was to write a chapter, I write a whole book on just that, because I think if my kids see me doing that, we, you know, we did, uh, we adopted a child with our church in another country. We get mail from him every other month. You know, we send stuff back. Uh, we sponsor him every month monetarily [00:37:00] and you know, we had got pictures of him at the house. And uh, you know, I explained to Judah, you know, I had a great time. The other week, we got a letter from Eric a couple of days ago. We got a letter from Alex and it's a little boy's name, Alex. And we sat on the edge of the bed and, and, and I told you about him. And I was like, this is what mommy and daddy do.

Speaker 3: We, uh, you know, we send, we send stuff to him, we'll pay for him, uh, you know, give him food and we love him. And we'd never even met him because he's, you know, we want to love people. And, uh, and I, I hope [00:37:30] that, uh, yeah, that's what, what my kids realize made charity not special is that we, we really try to love others. And, um, you know, we have fun. Don't get me wrong. We, we, we focus on our family too. We went to Disney. I bought a motorcycle a couple of months ago. You know, we have fun. Yeah. Certainly. But our lives don't revolve around me, me, me, me, me, me, me. Yeah. Our lives. If that's going to be the legacy that I create for my family, it will be that the Campbell's [00:38:00] love people and we love others. And we want to see everyone elevate, you know, and we want to see people work hard and earn it. Yeah. But that's what we want.

Speaker 2: That's wonderful. And actually a great segue to the question that, uh, Lewis house gave me. He's a podcast host for the school of greatness, but this is his question. And it is when do you feel the most loved?

Speaker 3: Oh, Hmm. Well, let's go. I [00:38:30] would say, have you ever read the book? The love languages, five love languages. Not in full. Yeah. The basic principle is that everyone's got a love language where, you know, they've received and they give love in different ways. So some people like words of affirmation, some people like touch. Some people like acts of service. Some people like gifts, you know, I th I would say that, uh, for me, the way I feel loved acts of service, hands down, like I could go like, like charity, the way she feels love words of affirmation, quality time. [00:39:00] Yeah. Those are her two big ones, right. For me, you want to make me feel loved. Whereas of affirmation. My, my coworkers and my supervisors will tell you that you give me a, you tell me I'm doing good at something. I'm going to go out and get you 10 more of whatever I just did. It's it's like fuel. Like you give me an encouraging word. I'm going to buckle down and give you all the more like, let's go. Yeah. Where's the affirmation. And, and acts of service when, I mean, it just floors me. And it's, it's humbling. Like when I, like, when I come home and see the [00:39:30] charity, you know, from after a long shift, spent all day cleaning stuff, putting my clothes away, making sure everything's nice and tight at the house. Like that. That's how I feel. Well, yeah. Like I'm like, yes.

Speaker 2: Are you good at expressing your appreciation for that?

Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so. I think so. I kinda like to be animated about stuff as, as you can probably tell. So it's like, you know, when people, you know, we're so fortunate, the police far where people bring cookies and stuff in and they love on us. And, uh, you know, [00:40:00] obviously we, chief Carter wants to make sure we take photos and stuff like that and show the community, you know, like, Hey, thank you guys so much for loving us. Like we want, we want, we can't say, thank you guys enough. Right. So I am I'm animated about it, but it's not, it's, it's certainly out of sincerity, you know, because I see it. Like we have, man, we have one lady that's been bringing us in. No one knows this. We got one lady that brings us a dessert, a cake cookies once a week has been doing it for the last [00:40:30] three and a half years. I've been there. Wow. It's unbelievable. Yeah. And I'm telling you every time I see it, like I get animated. I'm like, thank you so much. This is so great. And, and, and, and, and try to be that electric personality and to really let them know, like, this is so fun and thank you. And it's, it's just great. Yeah. So

Speaker 2: I believe she probably only shows up on the day there.

Speaker 3: I will tell you, she, she tends to give me, uh, the desserts that I asked for when I asked for [00:41:00] them. So I would say that that's probably correct.

Speaker 2: And my next question is Tim Ferris, this question, another podcast hosts. It's the billboard question. Yeah. 95. Every dad on the planet is driving 80 miles an hour. You've got a billboard that they have to be able to read when they drive by. And it's a piece of advice, fatherly advice. Yeah. What do you put on that billboard? Be

Speaker 3: Patient, be patient,

Speaker 2: Be patient. So are you patient?

Speaker 3: I, I'm not a naturally [00:41:30] patient person. I'm not, I mean, I, I think that's probably why I get along with Sergeant Moran, so, well, yeah, if you've ever met him, he's a very regimented, a guy who was in the Marine Corps and, uh, he likes it done absolutely right now. Right. And I can tell you that if it comes to like schoolwork, I still get a little, a little bit lazy about it. I'm like, ah, I don't want to do this. But if it's something that I want right now, like right now, I want you to stop hitting your brother rights thinking I wanted [00:42:00] it to stop yesterday right now. Right. So like, I'm not a naturally patient person. Like I like, let's go, let's get this thing going. Let's get the show on the road. Let's, you know, get this call done, whatever it is.

Speaker 3: Yeah. So if, if I know a thing or two about dads, it would be that we, you know, when we show emotion, it's different than mom shows emotion. You know, it's when, when I discipline Maverick, my youngest, he's two years old. I do it differently [00:42:30] than it would judo. Okay. So I can say something to Judah a hundred times and he won't do it. But if I spank him, he'll do it right. Older. He's older. But with Maverick, he'll go to touch something or do something he won't, I'll just, I'll, I'll sit down and I'll lean real close to him. I'll get in his ear and I'll say, Matthew, don't you do that. That's very bad. And then like, I'll lean back and you can just see his lips start to quiver and you'll see his water eyes. And he just gets hurt. It [00:43:00] hurts his feelings.

Speaker 3: Right. And so, um, you know, it's like, I have to remember to treat the kids in a way that will best affect the outcome that I need, and it's going to be different for each kid. And the only way you can do that as a dad, I believe is to be patient and to recognize what those avenues are and what those processes are and how each kid specifically communicates and then adjust your delivery by that. And [00:43:30] the only way you can do that is put billboards up everywhere. They say, just do calm down, be patient, you know, with it. So that's great.

Speaker 2: And this would be my, my, probably my second to last question, I almost hate to, I'm not almost, I definitely hate to stop this conversation because I'm enjoying it so much, but what's, what's a piece of advice that you've gotten. That was one of the best pieces of parenting advice.

Speaker 3: Oh my goodness. I have gotten so much good advice. Probably the one, one [00:44:00] thing is my father-in-law said something to me or said something, you know, I don't even think that he probably realized that he said it and it made such an impact, but, uh, he said, we just need to protect that. And what he was, what he was referring to was Judah is he is probably the nicest kid, little boy. I mean, he is just will at his little voice. He's so sweet. He will hug you. He hugs all his friends. Goodbye. He holds hands with everyone. [00:44:30] You know, he's just the, just the most adorable little guy. And I remember, and he's got such an imagination. And I remember my father-in-law, you know, pastor Barry, he was just like, and we just need to protect that as a family. That's what we need to do.

Speaker 3: We need to protect that there are things going to be out there that, that will rip a child's dreams away that will, you know, happen to where he won't be able to foster that imagination that created. We, uh, we, we create an abs for you of no don't know, don't know, don't know don't [00:45:00] and man, I think the only reason I'm I do, I'm able to do what I'm able to do now is because my parents didn't put those restrictions on me. They let me be that creative and, and really figure out how to play it. I mean, they let me play drums for hours on end from, you know, first, second grade, all the way up until I got out of high school. Yeah. Hours, dude. I mean, like I would come home and three, like if I didn't get three hours of straight drum practice in a night in high school, I felt like a failure.

Speaker 3: [00:45:30] Wow. I mean, it was like, that was the one thing I was disciplined in. Right. And so that really stuck with me. It's like, we need to, he said, we need to protect that. And that was a roundabout way of telling me that I need to do whatever I can to foster that positive outlook, that imaginative outlook, that loving outlook for my kid, you know, and protect them from that. That's, that's been the biggest [00:46:00] thing. That's beautiful. Yeah. That's all. It's awesome. And he's probably gonna listen to this and be like, I don't even remember saying, but that it made a big difference to me and he's right, because it's helped me in my discipline because it's like, I don't want him to see that ugly side of me where I lose my temper and, and, you know, throw stuff and just get angry and, and, and yell and stuff like that because that's not protecting, that's not protecting what he needs to know right now. Yeah. He needs to know that I'm, I'm loving and I'm a safe place that he can come in and [00:46:30] confide in. He's four. He should know this side of me until he's at, you know, late teens. And then he can start to see, you know, some of the more hard stuff and be exposed to some SF. But for right now, he needs to know me. And he as, as a loving, safe place to come as a dad, because I don't think that's going to carry us later. So that's awesome.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Christmas great though. Unfortunately, this is my last question. All right. So [00:47:00] first thank you so much, man. I've enjoyed this thoroughly.

Speaker 3: I have to. Absolutely. Thank you. It's

Speaker 2: Past my bedtime. Right. But it's worth every second. So this question is what message would you like to pass along in the event that this recording lasts forever to your kids? Their kids, their kids and their kids. Yeah. Oh, I got one more question first. I'd love it. I can't believe, I almost forgot the gift question. I love that. So, you know this question [00:47:30] now, if you could give a gift to every father on the planet, what is the gift that you would give them?

Speaker 3: Probably a,

Speaker 3: Probably a counseling session with Wally and pat Smith. How about that? That's probably a, a marriage counseling session are by no means is my life perfect. I think that's the hard part about social media is that if you were [00:48:00] to look at my life like you have, yeah. Oh man, he is God, he is a 32 year old and he's got his stuff together. He's got a family, you know, I've had people come up to me, strangers, complete strangers that have found me on Facebook, through links, in newspaper articles or whatever. And, and you know, they say you got the cutest little family. Like you guys, everything just looks so perfect. And then, you know, it's, it's Mayberry all over there. You know, you go and you do your thing and come home and things, you just it's Mayberry. Right. And it's like, [00:48:30] they don't know.

Speaker 3: They don't know charity. Now we're in marriage counseling for months. Yeah. We, we put so much of our initial part of being married, married into the church that we forgot how to love each other. And it just wrecked our marriage. And, um, we struggle with things. So if I could give one gift to every kid, I mean, it would be, it would be a counseling session with pat and, and, and, [00:49:00] uh, Wally from that, it would be, if you really want to do your kids a favor, it would be, if you really want to do yourself a favor, you and your wife got to figure out how to love each other. You got to figure out how to be married. You gotta be, you gotta figure it out. Cause if you guys don't have it together, it's going to trickle out into everything else. And it's still, dude, it's not perfect.

Speaker 3: I keep saying that throughout this whole podcast, it's not perfect because the stuff that I am telling you that I figured out, I figured out. Yeah, [00:49:30] but it's not a, it's a daily work on every single one of those issues. There are days where charity an hour, just 100, I'm getting raw right now. We're just humming. Things are great. And there are days where it's just like, I can't, I can't handle it. Yeah. So I would say that, uh, my piece of advice would just be, if you really want your kids, if you really want to be a good dad, love your wife. And if you really, really want to be a good dad, let your kids know that you love your life. You know, we do this [00:50:00] thing where I'll probably one of my favorite things to do is a fight with the kids over kisses from mama. Right. So I'll walk in and I'll say, I'll say, Hey, Judah, I'm getting the kisses from mom tonight. You know, I'm getting KIPP mama's kisses and then he'll get, no, I want mom his kisses and then same with same. And Mabee, they'll get all emotional. And then, you know, it's just a big loving thing. Yeah. So, and, and it's vulnerable. It's very intimate. And um, you know, I dig it. That's

Speaker 2: Awesome. Well, I [00:50:30] appreciate you're being authentic and genuine and open in sharing these things. I think so every person that listens to this is going to learn something I've learned a ton. I can't wait to relisten to it and learn more, you know, when I'm not focused on what I'm going to ask you next. But yeah. So here's that last question

Speaker 3: Again?

Speaker 2: The message to your kids, kids, kids, kids. Yeah.

Speaker 3: But others first love God. Love people. [00:51:00] Love her family, period, period. Nothing else you do that. Everything else fall in place. Love God. First love your family. Then love people. Everything else fall into place. Work comes after all those things. Finances comes after all those things. You know, if I could give one piece of advice, love God, love people. Love God, love, family love people that order here. We good. Awesome. Yeah, man. Thank you for having [00:51:30] me.

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